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Dear Reddit peeps,

I started the conversation on ry4 in Part I. u/Fieldgreens was kind enough to participate. Today we will continue the conversation without much ado.

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Prior Reviews:

Always important to search the sub for prior reviews.

Noted Episode 59: RY4 - watch this if you want to hear ID10-T break down the flavors with wayne (as only he can), u/CheebaSteeba's analysis, and u/mLnikon's endearing tobacco comments :)

FotW RY4 - pay particular attention to u/ChemicalBurnVictim’s notes in the comments

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Notes:

(1) JF Ry4 Double 4% / Steeped 52 days / 70/30

Caramel up front on the inhale that lingers through the whole exhale into the back end. There’s a distinct sweetness to it that is not offensive but noticeably candyish. Not like a granularly sugar but still a darker caramel molassesy sweet, nonetheless. The flavor somewhat disappears in the middle between the inhale and the exhale. Zero throat hit, very smooth. The more I vape it, the more the sweet slowly steps back and just stands as a slight caramel taste. I couldn’t tell you why but I already think I’d want to pair this with either a nuttier tobacco or with some kind of coffee notes. Overall, this strikes me as a pleasant, sweet caramel with no dirty, gritty, tobacco base at all. 4% I suspect is a mid range and it will need to go much higher to be considered a featured flavor and I could see it working as an accent in a cigar tobacco base for some sweetness, or used in a dessert as a dark undercurrent of caramel or just to deepen the sweet of say a cookie, or just pair with creams for darkness. Still though, I imagine, it will present distinctly unless paired up with something bold.

Concrete's review

Noted: u/ID10-T “better ingredient for tobaccos than TPA RY4x2 … nutty”

Who is this for? This is for the mixer who likes it sweet and dark and makes no apologies for making an RY4 featured mix.

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(2) Cafe Napoleon v1 6% / steeped over 60 days / 70/30

Decided to drip this right on top of what was left of the tpa ry4x2 since this is the oft touted combo that makes up Holy Holy Grail RY4 v1. And, yes, it seems legit. Maybe the combo itself was a bit less sweet than HHG v1 comes across to me. But this flavor transitioned into its own with that HHV distinct maltiness and a hint of coconut on the back end. Not sure what’s supposed to be the ‘cafe’ portion of this. It’s greasy. Personally, this isn’t my favorite vape solo. To be fair, the flavor grew on me as I vaped it, but still, it was way better when I first dripped it on top of the TFA RY4x2. They work really well together and complement each other well. Which brings me to my next flavor…

Who is this for? Nobody. V1 is discontinued. DIYVS does have a V2. I wouldn’t bother but I haven’t tried it. Having v1 would be exclusively to recreate HHG v1 or to build it yourself.

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(3) Holy Holy Grail RY4 v1 6% / more than 60 days / 70/30

This is the Holy Grail of Legend for a reason. It is damn fricken good. I originally mixed this a few months back and was off-put by the sweetness. I don’t know why now, but that isn’t really bothering me as much at the moment. If rumors are true, this is a house blend of some of the components of Holy Vanilla v1 and Cafe Napoleon v1 with TPA RY4x2 and it certainly vapes that way. There’s a healthy amount of sweetness that, I think, takes some of the edge off the off-notes from the TPA. The fullness of the flavor comes in the melding of the caramel that was only on the back end with TPA solo and now on the front end there’s top notes of sweet vanilla, followed by a golden caramel with an unparalleled mouthfeel. The sharper flavors of Cafe Napoleon (assuming that’s in here) add depth now to the caramel by giving it coffee notes I didnt get from the sft of CN and I suspect that whatever gave me that coconut on the back also adds to that luxurious mouthfeel, so realistic to a true caramel.

Noted: ID “luxurious rich thick and smooth ... vanilla, coffee, chocolate, brown sugar… smoked vanilla caramel”

Other opinions:

1. https://www.reddit.com/r/DIY_eJuice/comments/828zgh/diyfs_holy_holy_grail/ - gets a bit of a chemical off taste. I think that one is sweetener, myself.
2. https://www.reddit.com/r/DIY_eJuice/comments/5rxh3x/diyfs_holy_holy_grail_ry4/

Who is this for? It’s for those who stocked the fuck up and love Cardinal.

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(4) Holy Holy Grail RY4 v2 6% / steeped 54 days / 70/30 (Courtesy of u/TeslaDelMar)

This wont be a popular opinion. Frankly, I think it’s better than v1. Yes, I said it. Lemme tell you why...First of all, it is lighter. This is actually a good thing. V1 is almost too distinct. Anyone who says v1 is better has actually tried v1 and has an emotional attachment to it. The loss of the overpowering sweetness is an improvement in this flavor. Losing that actually allows me to appreciate the caramel flavor here. Sure, it’s a thin caramel taste… yeah, you probably will reach for something else, but if you already bought v2, you have a thin caramel layer with an incredibly pronounced vanilla. Frankly, the vanilla here is so strong, I would just use this as a vanilla one-shot addition to a tobacco blend with another caramel or another ry4 for a vanilla top note. If I actually had some, of course. Not a solo flavor imo, but has room to be filled out.

Who is this for? This is for the mixer who already owns it, or is trying v2 for the first taste of HHG. It comes across to me more of an additive for a distinct bend towards the vanilla-ish end. As I don’t generally recognize vanillas much as a distinct flavor, I’d say that this would be good for anyone like me, then :)

Great breakdown of HHGv1 vs. HHGv2 by u/TeslaDelMar

(5) TPA Asian RY4 4% / Steeped 53 days / 70/30

Another one that grew on me. I just wasn’t happy with my first taste but, you know, I bothered to rewick so I was sticking to it. Here I am, an hour later shaking my head after each pull like, whoah, what? What a strange RY4 this is! It almost has this strange cereal taste to it. Like a Honey Bunches of Oats golden nuttiness. I don’t know what combination of caramel and flavoring im getting here but there’s definitely that aromatic tobacco feel here and solo it’s a very interesting flavor. This is another one that I clearly can vape solo. I have no idea how it never came on the radar before. I only added it to my order for thoroughness, and boy am I glad I did. I could see using this with those golden syrupy flavors like maybe INW Gold Ducat, Am4a, TA VA.

Noted: u/ID10-T “sweetness like honey filtered through half smoked, crumpled up black and milds and old coffee grounds … people who crave novelty (hipsters) [might like this]”

Who is this for? This is for the mixer who burnt out on RY4 and wants a change, something golden, or something to add to a spicy aromatic mix. Or just a featured flavor that is different (for you hipsters).

Bonus Notes:

(6) Magical Flavors RY4 4% / steeped 54 days / 70/30 (courtesy of u/Apexified)

I actually had somehow missed this one and vaped it after I was done making all the prior reviews. I grabbed bottles off the desk to just finish them off casually and was struck by this flavor since I didn’t recognize it. I must have seen the MF on it and thought it was MB. This one at 4% is still a little thin which makes me think that their flavor range may be on the weaker side. Still though, at 4% it’s presenting as an ry4 with a dark molassesy caramel that is still thinner than I’d like but I guess that’s cool too, because I would probably just reach for JF if that’s what I wanted. It’s more of a brown sugary feel than molasses, I’d say. Without that creamy, sticky mouthfeel, it comes across as sugar to me. Light that light brown baking sugar fresh out of the bag before it gets all hard and crumbly. It’s moist, has a hint of top note which I assume is vanilla. But all of it is just at half mast at best. This probably needs to be pushed up to 6-8% to have any oompf; maybe that high it’ll give more dark brown sugar?

Who’s this for? This is for the mixer who was lucky enough to receive the flavor as a tester from u/Apexified. It’s okay at best but I don’t feel I got a good sense for it at 4% but I am also not really excited to try it again any higher with the other flavors I have already tried in my collection.

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(7) Magical Flavors Cigar 3% / Steeped 52 days / 70/30 (courtesy of u/Apexified)

The flavor here either faded completely or just never got the invitation to the party. Definitely not close, just no cigar. There’s so little flavor that the taste of the VG is coming through clearly with just a hint of peanut (presumably from the juice) and a dash of fresh cotton. Clearly this either fades or I was waaaaaay off on my initial test and have to retry at 6-8%. Which makes me very sad. At least now, I don't have to rewick.

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Conclusion:

There you have it folks. I do have a bunch more to review and that's on hold for a few weeks so, probably gonna get to it in September, knowing me. If at all. I've kind of learned that some of the obscure flavors are obscure for a reason. Makes me less likely to go panning hoping for a nugget of gold. For the next installment, I am going to look at ry4 mixes and see what's out there. If you have a recipe (your own or someone else's) that uses/features ry4, send it my way in the comments/pm and i will try it and review it and, hopefully, steal the best parts :)

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This whole project started with an end result hoping for a recreation of Holy holy clone or a replacement of sorts. I think I'm over it. With so many flavors with unique characteristics, I just feel like why bother recreating something when we can make something new. If cloning a juice is hard, cloning a concentrate is even harder for me.

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If you liked reading this, consider writing a post yourself. I do appreciate that this series is a mix of people of all different abilities. Please do let me know if you have an idea you want to do a little write up. Share your hard work with the world and pay it forward to the next mixer!

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Previous Tutorial Tuesday Posts here

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keep mixin' keep sharing.

- i