I've just moved from a country where cigarettes are less than $2/pack, to a place with some of the most ridiculous tobacco prices in the world. I figure I need to quit smoking or start growing excess kidneys to sell!
Before moving to the cheap country I was living in a place where vaping was common, and I purchased a cheap MTL setup which I still have. Unfortunately it's illegal for shops to sell nicotine juice here, but it's legal to buy nicotine juice online and bring it into the country. This has led me to research mixing my own juices since my choices are; importing nic ejuice, or importing nic concentrate to mix with local juices. I have decided for maximum economy and most fun, I'm going to take the plunge of mixing my own juice from concentrates! I've been working as a chef for many years, and the minor of my science degree is chemistry, so I'm sure I can come up with something decent for my tastes.
My questions relate to some general advice about mixing recipes for a high nic juice. I've been looking at recipes online and it seems most of them are geared towards sub-ohm or low nic/high volume vaping.
I am interested in mixing juices that taste good at approx 20mg(+) nic salts. My equipment to start is a Smoka MTL with 1.5ohm at 13W. It's a shitty little vape with low airflow and small restricted holes for juice to wick into the coil.
- If I'm not mistaken, PG is the base for transporting flavour into the mouth, while VG provides the cloud and a certain amount of smoothness and mouthfeel. I am not interested in clouds. If the ratio of PG is increased, would I also increase the amount of flavour I taste?
- Some sources suggest that PG can create harshness and dryness. What ratio can I go up to without too much throat harshness?
- Since I will be consuming fractions of the juice volume of typical sub-ohm vapes, should I increase the flavour percentages accordingly when mixing in the concentrates?
- Would anyone recommend different VG:PG ratios for different styles of flavour? ie; higher PG for tobacco or menthol, higher VG for fruit?
Thanks for any advice you can give me! I've tried searching the post history and reading sections from the sidebar but didn't find much information regarding these points. If it's already been written feel free to call me a dumbass as long as you point me towards the applicable articles :D :D
Did you check out the post stickied to the top of the sub? One of the FAQ write-ups linked in there:
I believe this called curb service.😉
PG is a universal irritant. However, sensitivity to it varies, as does personal response to pain. If you're a masochist with low sensitivity to PG you could mix 70% PG and be fine, while if you're sensitive to PG and pain-averse 20/% PG may be too high. Luckily there are alternatives to PG, namely PEG and PDO.
As to your other questions, the link given is the answer.
When I vaped before (approx 2 years ago), I used cheap store-brand juices. I didn't have any issues with harshness or throat hit except at high nicotine levels. I assume I don't have issues with PG. Is there any other reason one of these alternative solvents might be superior?
I can say I also vape mtl and pod about 98% of the time. I still develop and taste recipes DTL single coil rda but also will exclusively mix and test for both pod and mtl rta.
I’ve tried going as high as 30/70 vg/pg (yes you read that right). It was a little runny and prone to occasional leakage while not significantly improving flavor. Definitely a bit of harshness on the throat which I didn’t mind at first but wore on me after about two weeks. I’d say 40/60 vg/pg is as high I’d comfortably go these days. I usually mix a batch of base at 60/40 vg/pg and let the chips fall where they may after mixing.
Some flavors do act differently at low watts and can shine. Some don’t come through well at all. Some are so light that they’re just not worth the effort. An example recently for me was trying to create a super low watt (boulder rock) pod style recipe with LB white chocolate peppermint. LB recommends using that flavor at 12% so I figured I’d use it at 10 and boost with some flv creme de menthe and some fw creme de menthe. Failure. So weak the flavor and I kept bumping various parts up and up until I’ve given up on this as a contender. Just wasn’t worth it. Just came out as a slightly sweet mint with hints of something flavorful.
Another lovely failure was watermalone. Even dtl it’s a very soft watermelon flavor and watermelon itself is just a vague sweet fruit flavor anyway. Eventually I mixed in some mint and blackberry and grape for a decent mix in my pasito (rebuildable pod system). It works because the blackberry was a strong enough top note.
Definitely read the faq Friday post linked by apexified and read through that guide. It’s got all the info to avoid my mistakes. Otherwise, I’m going to suggest accepting a bit of experimenting and maybe even nic free mixes if nic is a valuable resource so you feel better pouring some down lackluster mixes down the drain.
Lots of people seem to use 50/50 for pod recipes. I use 60pg/40vg for juices for a calliburn pod device, which works for me. This is at 10mg freebase nic, as I am a former smoker trying to reduce nic. Best bet for you, read the sticky referenced, search for recipes on elr or other recipe sites made for pods, then dive in. I look for relatively strong flavors and avoid complex recipes, as just coming off smoking I think my taste buds are still a little off. Get flavors to try a few recipes, than tweak to your taste. If you make small (10ml) testers to start it is cheap to experiment with different ideas. Maybe invest in a pod device as well, if you hate yours. The calliburn works for me, no cigs for 11 months now.
Thanks for the advice! I will be starting with simple stronger fruit flavours, and possibly a tobacco type (maybe an RY4?).
I'm starting vaping mainly due to an extremely tight budget right now. From what I see, pod vaping is more expensive? Although I like the idea of being able to alternate flavours quickly.
If you diy pod vaping should not be expensive with refillable pods. The devices are inexpensive, and the pods last through multiple refills. Using a higher nic level means you usually go through less juice, so diy supplies last a long time. I only use a mil or 2 a day at 10mg nic. If you have problems figuring out flavors you like, alot of people like unflavored juice, which removes the cost of flavors from the equation. That said, trying different recipes is a lot of fun.
> I've just moved from a country where cigarettes are less than $2/pack, to a place with some of the most ridiculous tobacco prices in the world.
Is your new home girt by sea?
Fair suck of the sav mate, I've got no idea what you're talking about!
But seriously, the price of everything has gone up so damn much! It's putting the cunt in country!
Haha! Too right mate. I've got plenty of recipes geared towards MTL vaping. What sort of profiles do you like? I strongly suggest you get a Kroma-a Zenith Kit from somewhere like Vapoureyes. Get a few packets of 0.8ohm coils. Tell me what flavour profiles you like - I'll hook you up with some recipes. Mix around 60VG/40PG.
Thanks for the offer mate!
So far I've enjoyed fruity flavours, but I really haven't tried much yet. What other types would you recommend? I've been smoking kretek clove cigarettes the last couple of years, maybe I would enjoy something along those lines, but I tried a freebie tobacco juice once and it was wretched....
I'm absolutely broke right now, hence the choice of vaping or selling kidneys. But I'll look into upgrading my equipment when I've got some dosh. My smoka ouf has the option of 0.8ohm coils too. What are the advantages/disadvantages of lower resistance coils?
The way to fine tune a recipe to your liking is to mix multiple variations, 10 ml each, and compare them. 50/50 is a good starting point for MTL pods. As for flavors, I would start at conservative levels and then move upward rather than vice versa.
If it's too harsh, maximize the PG and lower the nic salt percentages. The PG throat hit is a much better kind of throat hit than the very harsh kind that the nicotine gives. I would use 0%-20% VG maximum.