Didn't see any discussion around this yet but just got a link from my friend about HB4742. The bill could impose a tremendous tax on retail eJuice and most like diy nicotine. The way laws are flying around it may be wise to order a little extra on your next round.
https://vaping360.com/vape-news/86114/outrageous-nicotine-tax-bill-passes-house-committee/
Wow! If I’m understanding right , a 100mg/ 120ml bottle of nicotine will have $333.60 in taxes added to it.
Warning: drunken math rant incoming
$333.68 by my math, and yeah, that's just fucking tax, call it $350ish all in for a mere 12g of nicotine.
I went back and checked my invoices and, since 2014, I've spent a total of $326.24 on nicotine (~271.72g in all). Under HB4742, the tax on that would have been $7,555.62.
Probably better I put it in more relatable terms, though, so how about just in the case of me and my wife, we're talking a tax of over $430 per person per year: we go through about 150ml/wk, give or take (honestly I make so many different mixes this is a rough guess because I've never thought to actually measure how much we go through), and we both vape 3mg. Calling it 200ml to be safe, that'd be 600mg/wk * 52 wks/yr = 31.2g/year. This proposed tax is $50.33 per 1.81g, so $867.57 divided by 2 people.
When we smoked, we rolled our own. Tobacco and tubes cost us about $13 for a carton's worth, and between us we'd go through more than one but never more than two cartons per month. Two cartons a month comes to $312 a year. We could go up to a pack a day before paying as much as this tax would have us pay on nicotine alone, and we haven't even factored in other costs (flavors+diluent+coils+wicks+batteries, and I'd argue it'd be fair to calculate mod/tank/atty depreciation as well).
#TL;DR: these motherfuckers are trying to make smoking cheaper than vaping.
That's their end game, it's been documented they want people to smoke again so the states get their cut from the bonds set forth under the MSA agreements. Absolute scum bags, every single 'politician' involved should be fired....I would say they deserve worse actually...
This is what happenned in Portugal, only they introduced IQOS/Heets as an alternative because vapers just woudln't go back to stinkies, so they made it "less stinky" and not burning.
As I said elsewhere, Heets are pretty much nic salts sponged in rolled/dried tobacco leaves, heated using ceramic. It is currently much cheaper than vaping because they insta-approved EU-downstream regulation and took the chance to add a .6€ tax on every ml of e-juice containing ANY nicotine, and pretty much made illegal the sale of nicotine base to the public (it's pretty much a hard drug now, so it's traffic). They had 2 years to do this, they did it immediately since IQOS was already being sold in Portugal. This is the status quo:
- A pack of IQOS costs 4.5 eurobucks, contains 20 uses, lasts a day.
- 10ml of e-juice sosts 6Euro just in taxes, about 12€ retail. I used to use twice that daily
- IQOS/Heets are owned by Philip Morris a.k.a Altria
Take a guess at what was FDA-approved 2-3 months ago, and started being sold this month in the US...
For reference, Heets completely took over most of Europe. I now see a vaper a month on the street, if any, while I see IQOS/Heets users as much as I see smokers, yet on teenage venues I see about 70% of IQOS users, who probably never smoked.
Disclaimer: the reason I know is admittedly because I became addicted to Heets. Being akin to nic salts, they were much more addictive and effective for me quitting full-stinkies, than my 7-year long dual usage of e-juice+smokes at about 3-1 ratio. I'd love to try nic salts instead, but I didn't purchase it before the "purge" and now I would probably go to jail for that. Even my mother switched to IQOS almost instantaneously, from 1-pack a day of stinkies. That's how fucking effectively they made it.
I am not defending IQOS. I whish I could vape legally.
I hate what's happening lately. Why can't we just be left alone?
Because most governments want to steal from the population and use that money to buy votes.
And because governments are addicted to tax revenue from tobacco. And bribes from Big Pharma (who want vaping to die) and kickbacks from anti-smoker non-profits (who also oppose vaping because it reduces active smokers - which males their continued existence less likely - and because they actually hate smokers like hardcore Islamic nutjobs hate the civilized world, and since most vapers were smokers, thats close enougj for the rabid anti-smokers..
It wouldn't even be so bad if they were actually doing what they said they are and taxing nic juice at the same rate that cigarettes are (even though that's still dumb). But who even knows how they came up with the number they did, I sure as hell know it's not comparing the amount of nicotine consumed per vaper vs the amount of nicotine consumed per cig smoker, which would be the obvious thing to do. I guess they're assuming that people who buy 100mg/ml nic are actually vaping 100mg/ml? Absurd. Even then it still sounds absurdly higher than cigarette tax.
Yes, but free shipping.
Jokes aside I can't believe what Im reading this morning
so 1Litre of 100mg nicotine will cost about $2700.
In. tax. alone.
This bill still needs to go to the senate so it's not 100% going to happen
but it's probably a good idea for everyone to stock up now
BTW cigrrettes are exempt from the nicotine tax
That's within the realm of their thinking. At .3% nicotine that's 3600 mls. You might be able to get 500 or 600 mls of Unicorn Milk with that. But I doubt it there. I would squeeze from both sides and talk about the savings still available to people. Along with the fact that this was a tough decision because this hits close to home. I had a family member, a niece of my mine who had to be narcanned. Luckily she only took a couple hits off the Juul. I was thinking of a total ban people. Be happy.
I want to hear more about this niece of yours who had to receive narcan after “hitting the Juul.” Narcan is specifically an opioid antagonist.
Unless of course, you’re being sarcastic and my mood today has completely caused me to miss it.
While my wallet hates me, shit like this makes me feel ok about re upping yesterday. I was watching the developed livestream and they were talking about this bill. While Im sure that most of us newly here like myself saw where things were headed (hence going this route) I just wish more casual, non hobbiest type vapers were aware about what this really means.
God damn why are old people, baby boomers, so fucking monumentally stupid and ignorant? It pains me and breaks my heart to see so many millions of people being a sheep and just following what they are told without a single shred of effort being used to investigate the claims they hear vilifying vapes.
Fuck it. I'm picking up 10 years worth in November.
Im moving to the midwest or down south...fuck this shit.
Don't come to Illinois. Chicago is the land of the elites. It's another California. They don't care about us. They're gonna keep blaming us while they destroy our society and our bodies until they have their technocratic slaveship they monitor off planet. https://i.imgur.com/tsFvydH.gif
That bill might actually help vaping. Once governments get their slimy greedy mitts on a revenue stream from something, they are very protective of it.
nobody will afford these prices
2700$ in tax for 1 litre of 100 mg nicotine
maybe the FDA approved pod systems made by the cigarette companies will benefit
but this is not good for "vaping"
So, $81 per liter of juice, for the nicotine. Not great, but still way better than normal commercial juice prices. Yeah, massive upfront cost would suck.
Still, i think the government would stop being anti-vaping once they start making that money...
they (lobbyists of this bill, likely Altria/Philip Morris) only want to help themselves. They've introduced IQOS which is as addictive as Juul and are probably killing off Juul since they now have the replacement that does NOT fall in the category of vaping, and has been proved highly effective in Europe both getting stinky users to quit and NEW (even teenager) USERS hooked even easier than normal tobacco.
Your timeline is off.
IQOS predates Altria buying Juul. It didn't really have the uptake outside of Europe. (The antivaping laws in Europe may have been responsible, but...)
The main motove behond the bill os simpler... Vaping has hurt government revenues from tobacco. So they want to male that money back. And the real enemies of vaping (Big Pharma, Big Antismokers) would totally support this.
IQOS being invented/deployed before or after Juul is of no consequence. Philip Morris has been developing it for years now. The fact they bought Juul after IQOS existed just tells me they identified technology like what they had, and proceeded to buy the only thing that would compete (high nic content delivery, which I believe are akin to salts or the same).
And I think you're missing a small but if detail: IQOS pays hefty taxes too, as it is also deemed, like vaping, a tobacco product. Governments usually don't just want to keep revenue streams - they want revenue streams that also benefit their friends, because friends are who fund their campaigns and offer them millionaire retirement jobs. That's a lesson both big pharma, defense and babking has taught you guys well. Even my old Portuguese pal Durao Barroso did this, and fell from grace on corruption