Who is your favorite salt nicotine supplier? I've only ever used Nude Nicotine salt nic in all their variations and was wondering if anyone had any other recommendations. Who makes the formula closest to JUULs nicotine salts(I'm aware that JUUL has a patent on their formula but was hoping there is a supplier that is close)?
JUUL adds Benzoic acid to their freebase nic. This is what simulates the harshness of their product (adding an acid to freebase creates nic salt).
Benzoic acid is very harsh. Standard nic salt devices like the caliburn, nord, etc. produce too much vapor and it would be very uncomfortable to try and vape a salt formula that utilizes benzoic acid.
Not a big deal in a super small device like a juul, but any device with more power/vapor will be too harsh.
Nic river doesn’t use benzoic acid. AFAIK no standard supplier does. Their throat hit concoction isn’t really what you’re looking for. I’ve tried it and “throat hit” formulations from other manufacturers and they honestly weren’t worth fussing over.
The best way to simulate more throat hit would be using flavorings & blending freebase with nic salt to borrow a bit of the TH caused by freebase nic.
Note that the simulated hit from freebase nic isn’t going to be exactly the same though. Benzoic acid is more throaty, whereas freebase is more like a harshness in your lungs. So finding harsher flavorings can help you get that burn in your throat.
TFA cinnamon red hots is a flavoring that comes to mind. Tasty puff Rasta root beer is really throaty. FLV rich cinnamon could work too.
Some things are quite wrong explained... Benzoic acid alone would feel harsh, because its an acide (ph<7). Nicotine freebase alone feels harsh, because it is an alkalic (ph>7). Both combined create salts and the Ph-Value of the liquid isnt alkalic any more, so less harsh feeling in the the throat.
As a result, you can vape much higher mg/ml concentrations. Your body absorbs LESS percentwise, wenn there is less freebase, but the higher consumable dose is more than compensatimg it.
Most manufactures add Benzoic acid, some Salicylic acid. Some big suppliers like nicriver reffer to it, by calling it nicsalt typ S or typ B.
Others call it „smooth“ Formula (salicylic nicotinate) or „hit“ formula (benzylnicotinate).
Salicylicnicotinate in the same concentration is more near to Ph 7 than benzylnicotinate in the same concentration, so it feels less harsh than Typ B. But in the same mg/ml concentration Typ B will be absorbed better by your body, because membran transfer works better, if its more alkalic.
Juul uses 59mg/ml Benzylnicotinate (this is the salt form) and heats it TC to 200 degree Celsius with around 7-8W of Power.
Its tempcontrolled because at around 320 degree benzylacid will form benzol. But unless you use a subohm-device in VW with stupid high power and/or create a bad dryhit, you will not create it. The cotton would burn at around 250 C, you would smell it first. But this is the reason why you read „dont sub ohm“ on (benzyl-)nicsalt-liquids.
No Problem vaping 50mg/ml benzylnicotinate from a Caliburn, it runs at max 11W(first few puffs). It hits the throat like a 12mg/ml freebase nic.
Can you elaborate on temp? I was under the impression that the "no sub ohm use" was because it's usually used for high dosages. Freebase hurts my lungs so I've been using salt in my dripper at 3mg. Around 60w.
Not the original guy:
What part do you want elaboration on?
The "no sub ohm" rule is a general rule to keep people from being stupid.
It's more for people who are buying 50mg nic-salts from stores and trying to subohm them. They run the risk of too much nicotine AND possibly burning the liquid too hot.
Running the liquid too hot can happen, but like he talks about, there's two types of salt-nic, and it's not super likely that you're hitting those top temps anyway, even if you do have one of the "hit" liquids.
If you want to be 100% that you're safe, use a TC mod (a lot of mods have it now), and swap from Kanthal wire if that's what you're building with. Nichrome, titanium, stainless and ni200 all are valid TC options.
TC requires a bit more learning, as far as setup goes, but it's pretty damn easy once you do that little bit of learning. You never really need to worry about burning your cotton out or anything with it as well, which is obviously another plus.
Thank you for the info, I have nothing against NN "smooth" formulation(which is what I normally use), but I was looking for something better if there is one. Also, I make juice to refill JUUL pods, that's why I'm looking for nicotine that's the closest. And I agree with the "throat hit" formulations, I was not a fan of them. I mix my juices with a very high amount of nicotine (55-65mg), so I like to stick with a formula with very low throat hit because the shear amount of nicotine I use will give the throat hit no matter what.
Carolina Xtract
Wow, I wasn't aware that there was a company using benzoic acid other than Juul. I need to try it. What is your review on it compared to other formulations? Thank you , I'm excited!
I made the switch last year and won't use anything else for DIY. The impact in terms of it affecting flavor profiles was that noticeable.