#Hot Seat Sunday
Edit: I've got this guy to autoreload every 5 minutes. I will also have to step out a bit later on but I will do my best to answer evereyone's questions as time allows. Thanks for your patience.
So, this is an idea for a weekly thread… Basically it's a AMA thread with a twist – the 'victim' gets to name who is next up in the rotation. It was started by u/juthinc in this thread here and it was continued by u/isuamadog in here, and continued here by u/humanpuck , followed up by u/eyemakepizza, and finally by u/ID-10T here.
There are some rules:
- try picking someone who hasn't gone yet
- it has to be someone who actively posts here
- no dead people (ie: notcharlesmanson isn't eligible)
- preferably a name that people recognize, 'regular poster' means someone who is a) alive and b) has posted in the last three months
- Complete the FAQ before posting
- If you do the hot seat, you can add up to three names to the list of people who are potential victims. Now, in the interest of saving some likely to be asked questions from coming up multiple times, I've included a FAQ below. With that said (and remembering to not repeat questions from the FAQ) fire away. Oh, and next time, it's someone's turn and you will be pm'ed regarding your participation. (possibly /u/concreteriver /u/Coop34 /u/chemicalburnvictim /u/AlfredPudding /u/Foment_Life u/Apexified u/mlNikon ).
Already Done: u/juthinc, u/isuamadog , u/humanpuck , u/eyemakepizza , u/ID10-T
FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)
1. How'd you get your handle? I got a free CE4 and ego with 10ml of generic vanilla juice. I had been 1-1.5 PAD smoke for about 10 years with no intention of quitting but I thought damn, this is pretty decent. I think I like it better. While researching everything I ended up finding and joining Reddit. I wanted a username that was vape related and I loved the game Ape Escape so vApe_Escape was born. Why is the v lowercase? Its actually silent.
2. How long have you been mixing for? 2015...ish. Arbitrary dates and I don't go well together I couldn't tell you the month I stopped smoking and some have it to the minute but a fair amount of time.
3. MTL or DTL? Both. MTL for my work/yardwork mech because its got a single battery, my NETs taste better in MTL(most of the time), and really a MTL RDA works great with a tiny beater REO Grand.
4. Current flavor or profile obsession? Tobaccos, always tobaccos, but not always just tobaccos. I like making hybrid mixes as well. I'd love to do a good black walnut but AFAIK there is a single BW flavor on the market and its not good.
5. Most/Least disappointing flavors that was/not as expected? Secret Weapon? Most was trying every pineapple on the market and finding out that every single one gives me a headache with a single hit. Secret weapon: 50/50 combo INW DNB & one of the INW Absolutes (whichever suites the flavor)
6. Mixing Milestone? I think its one we all share, that first time that you make a mix and its just right. Not just good enough to vape but the kind where you hit it, take a moment staring at your vape, and are like, "Damn, I did that?"
7. Recipes you admire/love? Wouldn't be a post if I didn't mention my love for /u/xGRANITEx's (fucking callback to Myspace days with those x's huh?) astoundingly versatile Buttermilk Pie. Awesome as a standalone but, man, the possibilities with this recipe are endless. I've probably tried a dozen variations and all were great.
8. What the hell is a NET, why do you make them instead of buying synths, and how do you make them? NET stands for Naturally Extracted Tobacco. It is a flavoring agent made from filtered tobacco. It is not to be confused with Tobacco Absolutes or WTA(Whole Tobacco Alkaloids which are all about the feel while NETs are all about the flavors. Yes they are more gunky but it depends on the method of extraction and level of filtration. For example, Hangsen's tobaccos are NETs but they use a very complex process to get it so clean. As a general rule of thumb the more you filter the less nuance and flavor. It is worth nothing that I have only worked with hot and cold maceration of ethanol and PG and variants there of and not steam distillation. I do still use synths oftentimes in combos with NETS. As for making them I would recommend reading through these threads: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forums/liquid-extraction-from-tobacco.489/ If you want to try NETs but not spend the time making them or the money on buying extracts trubacco has a sample pack for a couple of bucks.
9. White Whale? I want to nail the perfect NET process for home use. I've found and am pretty confident that immersion circulators are the way to go for your initial process. Nailing down the exact temperature, how long, storage before/after/or before and after filtration and how long are still up in the air. Its going to be a long process.
10. What is your experience with vaping in the medical field? I graduated yesterday, in that time I have worked with pulmonologists and discussed vaping for a number of doctors. In that time I had to do a 3 month project. I chose a 3 month trial on the effects of vaping and nicotine on blood pressure and cardiovascular health with in never smokers, former smokers, former smoker current vapers, never smoker current vapers, and current smokers. I'm happy to say it was good news with vaping only moderately spiking blood pressure for a very short interval. The results will be published in Nature magazine. (Please don't dox me.) I have to stop and thank Evolv here because we used their chips in all the devices and that researcher tab really came in handy. Feel free to ask away about the above but please don't ask me to diagnose anything.
11. How would you describe your mixing style? Wew, it can really be anything from shit I'm out of juice so lets bust some out real quick to spending months and months on a single flavor trying to get it just right. It all depends on what I have time for. I try to eschew any preconceived notions when mixing. I grew up on a farm and my brother runs an Avant Garde restaurant so that has helped open my eyes a lot to the possibilities out there and taking each flavor on its own rather than going by descriptions or doing some creative pairings.
12. Advice for new mixers? Everyone says read, read, read and while I agree its a bit too 1984 for me. Be your own mixer. Mix for yourself. Do the research, test the flavors, do some trial runs. You eat everyday. You know what tastes good to you. Take that and say this tastes good and I bet it would go well with this. Take examples from real life but don't limit yourself to them. We aren't cooking. We have a lot more options for experimentation because of it. Ask anyone who has been mixing for any length of time and they will tell you they have bought shit flavors or made horrible juice. Its going to happen. Don't worry about it when it does. This isn't like vaping where you can just fill a pod and go. You get out exactly what you put in.
question 1: what took you so long?
Lol, so long to do what?
to post, silly!
I’m going to make a recipe and name it after you. What should the flavor profile be or which ingredient(s) must it include?
What is your all time favorite flavor?
Flavor like flavor profile or actual flavoring?
An actual individual flavoring that someone can buy, like INW Shisha Vanilla or TFA Pear.
Who wins the Game of Thrones?
Jamie will be willing to kill The Bitch but she will die in childbirth as a callback to Lyanna. Danny will likely be killed or for some other reason not take the throne.
So, Jon Snow, then?
I feel like he could but I don't know if he will. Perhaps the kingdoms will be dissolved and set up like the EU with the North pulling a Brexit.
The real winners are all the normal people who don't have to deal with their shit getting rocked all the time.
are you ever tempted to smoke the tobacco that you are using for NETs? (idk why but that's a huge fear of mine... well i know why, but still...)
You don't have to state which side of it you're on, but of all the various divisive political issues, which one is most important to you?
Jesus, fuck. I'll come back to this one tonight when I've had a drink.
You drinking yet?
Just got home and cracked a 10W-40 Salted Maple Imperial Stout from Hi-Wire and I've got a Schneiderweisse Aventinus lined up after that.
About to go watch Game of Thrones and Barry then I'll be back to check on more questions and I'll cover this one.
I would say 2A rights though I am by no means a single issue voter. I usually find that if they are 2a supporters then they also support the constitution especially at the local and state levels. With the national levels its usually the lesser of the two evils.
I would consider myself a constitutionalist and a Jeffersonian Democrat if I had to put a label on my political leanings.
Really cool to hear that you did some investigation on vaping, getting it to Nature is definitely not a small thing... Regardless of the outcome, investigation on vaping is necessary... I'd love to read it, is it already published somewhere else or is there any way to access it? Maybe I can find it from my university program if it's behind a paywall (i study medicine too and our university has some weird program that lets you see articles that are behind a paywall as long as you are logging in from the university wifi...
It will be in June's issue of Nature I believe which you can access online. Again, please don't dox.
There are some clauses in my program regarding social media and there are also some things that could be looked at the wrong way(hence the no "diagnose me questions" stipulation.)
What kind of studies would you be interested in doing if things like funding weren't an issue?
To be frank I just did the research because it was a graduation requirement and related to the area I want to work in as well as something I was interested in and vaping can use all the research it can get. I'm hoping to get a cardiothoracic surgery fellowship when I finish my residency. I did enjoy it though and am glad I could contribute at least in part to the mounting research pointing towards vaping as a better option than using tobacco products.
I smoked cigarettes for the nicotine and not for the flavor. I don't think I'll ever vape a tobacco flavor any time soon. I think the reason I like TFA Ry4 double is because it "isn't" a real tobacco. Can you explain a little bit why it isn't? And will I like DFS Holy Holy Grail Ry4 if I like TFA. I don't really want to try FLV, INW, or Hangsen knowing I may not like them.
​
Also, I played Ape Escape on PSP ages ago. I always thought about it when I saw you on here.
It’s not my AMA, but it isn’t really a tobacco flavor because the flavor molecules used to make that flavor are Cyclotene (sort of a burnt caramel/maple flavor,) Vanillin (you can guess what that is,) and Ethyl Maltol (also sold as TFA Cotton Candy.) So there’s nothing in there that really even tastes like a synthetic tobacco, let alone real tobacco. The “tobacco” some people get out of it is probably just a bit of harshness and dirtiness from the Cyclotene.
I imagine you will like the Holy Grail stuff. My understanding is that it is TFA RY4 Double mixed with some other caramel stuff that DFS makes. Never had it since I’m not big on RY4s, but there’s probably a good chance you’ll like it.
Also, don’t let the other tobaccos scare you. They aren’t going to taste like cigarettes (I wish they did.) At least maybe pick up some FLV Red Burley or something to dip your toes in the tobacco waters. The INW might be a bit risky to start with because they’ve got a lot of bad ones, but also have a lot of my favorites. But I also really like dirty and smoky tobaccos.
> Also, don’t let the other tobaccos scare you. They aren’t going to taste like cigarettes (I wish they did.) At least maybe pick up some FLV Red Burley or something to dip your toes in the tobacco waters. The INW might be a bit risky to start with because they’ve got a lot of bad ones, but also have a lot of my favorites. But I also really like dirty and smoky tobaccos.
Ignore me if this is too much, but I know you're super renowned around here for your tobacco recipes, I quit vaping years back, ended up smoking pipe tobacco for the past year or so, want to quit because it messes with my breathing and now I am trying to find something that's at least somewhat like real tobacco, that standard Virginia/burley flavor.
I made a lot of my own juice in the past and tried all the standard RY4, TFA stuff like Cuban, MildnBlack, Latakia, etc. Then I tried Am4a and even that is way too fake and sweet - would rather just have a fruit vape. Am4a tasted like a weird Port wine to me, bit raisiny. Maybe like a Marsala wine.
But I saw some of your recipes and your descriptions of the flavors sounded far better like you've tried a lot of concentrates I haven't - basically what I'm getting at here is what would you recommend for me to make a basic tobacco with as few ingredients as possible?
Like I said I am interested in a more virginia/burley or kentuckyish (but not super smoky) flavor without sweetness - if you've found anything like that I'd be super happy to know. If there's any of your recipes you'd recommend I'd be interested.
I'd like to eventually buy the ingredients so I can make it into salt juice but at this point I'm willing to just buy juice for the convenience so I can stop smoking again lol.
You want to use nicotine salts, so are you going to be using a pod system? Either way, I think keeping it simple will probably be good. If you are after a sort of generic Virginia/Burley type of thing, you could try out FLV Virginia and FLV Red Burley. It might end up a bit sweeter than you’re looking for though. A super simple Kentucky might be a little better. It’ll be a bit smoky, but not as intense as actually smoking a Kentucky Blend, so you might like it. A three ingredient Kentucky:
Flavor Revolution Woody Tobacco- 2%
FLV Kentucky- 1%
FA Black Fire- .5%
Flavor Revolution is only sold at Nic River, so if you don’t order from there, you could drop it and just bump up the FLV Kentucky to 2% and adjust from there. I’d keep the Black Fire at .5% though unless you feel like you want it smokier.
the FLV Red Burley has always been sitting in the back of my mind I just can't seem to pull the trigger you know? thx for replying tho. for whatever reason you are somehow a final authority on tobacco here
since you mostly use NETs, how do you keep notes/records of your mixes? paper/pencil? etc?
I don't mostly use NETs though I do use them daily for the most part.
As for my process yes. I keep a notebook with every step in each process I try but the thing it is can take months to produce a single batch and some even leave theirs for a year or more.
Every variable as to be accounted for so the notebook is necessary and I have to use the same tobacco every time for consistency though I do make other NETs with other tobaccos.
Which tobacco flavors would you suggest for someone who wants to take their first steps into the dark side?
I guess that didn't really answer you. I would say Gold Ducat, Am4a, Kent, DNB, the tobacco absolutes, Gold, black, and dark for pipe, oakwood, red oak, red burley, Connecticut shade, tatanaka tobacco, French Pipe. I'm sure there are a few others I am forgetting. Acetyl Pyrazine is also good to have around. For RY4s hangsens is really good. TPA is not really a tobacco. Jungle Flavors is kind of in between but leans more towards RY4 Double than Hangsen's RY4. I would probably say go for FLV>INW>Hangsen>and then from there just pick and choose the few good ones from the other companies. The first three are mostly all pretty decent whereas the other companies just have a few that are standouts.
Maybe some others will come along and recommend a few more to start with but Inawera and Flavorah are two great places to start. Definitely check out the last 2 tobacco flavor of the weeks. (one is very recent and is 3 parts and the other is a year old or less with some great info as well and is 2-3 parts. Both are worth a read)
I would say its also important to remember your supporting flavors as well.
Like anything its going to be like starting all over with DIY to be quite honest. There is a huge range of flavors just within tobacco flavorings.