#Let's Discuss Nic Salts
###This week's FAQ Friday is a little different
>Instead of writing up a whole post that attempts to answer the most Frequently Asked Question in one shot, I'm going to open the topic up for discussion and crowdsource the answers in one place and then compile the discussion into a page in the wiki.
###If you have a question about nic salts, this is the best time and place to ask.
###Some of the frequent questions about salts:
- What’s the difference between Nicotine and Nicotine Salts?
- Should I give Nic Salts a try?
- Mixing Salts for a Pod System
- Mixing Regular Nic with Nic Salts
- And many more...
###What do you want to know about nic salts?
>And please keep in mind that links to sites that sell nicotine are not allowed on Reddit. Feel free to mention the vendor by name without including a link.
Fact: Nicotine Salts are calculated and mixed no differently than freebase.
Does this also apply to Salted Nic?
Is that true?, I just went to Nicotine River ( Nic Tab - pure Nic vs. Salts ) and the pages show a chart that exclaims freebase Nic is no different in maths, yet no explanation on mixing Salts in same chart.
Yes. Concentration doesnt change just because its in a different form
Correct me if I'm wrong, from what I've read on this sub from multiple threads on NIC salts. Is that if your freebase and NIC salt is the same strength e.g 100mg of pg based freebase and salt, you can make a 50/50 blend in a bottle and you'd use that as you would either the freebase or salt in a recipe.
I'll add some nerd stuff since no one is talking about it in detail. One thing that seems to be commonly misunderstood is that freebase nicotine is chemically pure nicotine in pg or vg. Nic salts is where the nicotine is chemically bound to typically benzoic acid but there other formulas - forming a salt.
A salt in chemistry is "any chemical compound formed from the reaction of an acid with a base, with all or part of the hydrogen of the acid replaced by a metal or other cation". Think of table salt - sodium chloride, it has 2 parts. So in the case of nic salts, the cation is nicotine and the acid is benzoic acid.
Given that the nicotine and benzoic acid are chemically bound in the end product, the total molecule is more stable, less subject to oxidation than freebase nic. It has already reacted, therefore it's less reactive...
As there is 2 parts to nicotine salt, not all of the product is nicotine - obviously some of it must also be the "salt". If you're speaking strictly about the common benzoic acid formula, and compare the molecular weight of nicotine and benzoic acid, you can calculate that in 100mg, 54mg will be nicotine and the other 46mg will be benzoic acid. Other formulae will differ slightly.
I use nic salt in a sub ohm tank (0.17 ohm, 50-55 watts), so I went from 3mg freebase to 6mg nic salts, and the satisfaction became much greater. This amount for me, is a little too much in an rda @ 45-50 watts, because the rda hits harder. In my opinion, the strength you need depends more on your device than how much you smoke (or smoked), hence the high strength used in the little pod devices - lower power, less hit...
Your pseudoscience assumes that the nicotine salts are first formed, precipitated out of solution, measured and then diluted into a new base. 100mg/ml nicotine salts will contain 100mg of nicotine per ml, because they're mixed to do so. This also explains the cost difference... Nic salts replace some of the cheaper VG or PG with a more expensive acid. This increased cost (plus the cost of labor and/or equipment to do the mixing) is responsible for some of the cost.
This is what info I've been able to find to date, if you can provide me with a source of something better, I'd appreciate it because I've found quality information hard to come by
I initially thought the same as you, but have found an MSDS that shows (at least for this company) that they mix at a higher percentage (174.83mg/mL) of salts to be equivalent of 100mg/mL freebase.
Link to a screenshot of the MSDS as I don't think I can direct link because they also sell nicotine.
I think they are just confused on your terminology. 100mg/ml nic salts will have around 100mg per ml of solution, and also the around 100mg of the acid. But you are saying in a random 100mg salt composition you would find around 54 mg nicotine and 46 mg benzoic acid. Probably unnecessary for simple terms
Fact: nicotine salts are not exclusively for use in pod systems
(Also, for the really basic - nic salts are a way of getting all the satisfaction (or buzz), but none of the throat-rape, of higher (ie >3mg/ml) nicotine concentrations.)
Why can't I use nic salts in a subohm setup? Will I die? Will my tank explode?
One question I see a lot from people outside the US/CAN is "Where can I get Nic Salts?"
What vendors do you use outside of the US/CAN or do you import from vendors here?
If I vape 1.5mg freebase, would you suggest I vape also 1.5mg nic salt, or bump it to 2 or even 3?
Depends what you are looking for, if you want higher nic levels without more throat hit then for sure. If you want to maintain your current nic intake, but smooth it out even more then just keep it at 1.5. personally I don't think it will make a huge difference at that low of a level if you use salts or not, but maybe someone else can chime in.
DISCLAIMER: There seems to be many accounts (at least to me) of weird side effects from exclusively using salts for a period of time. Tightness in chest, wheezing, dry cough, asthma like symptoms, dry mouth, dizziness, & headaches have all be sent to me from users who were concerned. Ranges were around 6mg up to 48-54mg. Just wanted to make it known that if you have these sort of effects, removing salts from your vaping could alleviate them. Also, I'm not saying NicSalts carry these side effects as correlation =/= causation, but once these users removed salts from their vaping, side effects subsided.
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Interesting. I switched to salts some months ago (35mg) and lately I’ve been noticing a weird shortness of breath sensation after vaping them. It could just be the high concentration. I’ve switched back to a lower nic freebase and it seems to have helped; I’m keeping an eye on it.
What I understand about nic salts, and how I sell them is by telling customers that there are two main kinds of eJuice. Freebase and salt nicotine. Freebase Nicotine is plant-based, and salt nicotine is a natural derivative directly from the crystals that form on the tobacco leaves during production.
the difference in effect is that salt nicotine is supposed to be more easily absorbed by your system and last longer in your bloodstream, which is supposed to reduce the urge to smoke, or keep puffing on a larger sub ohm device.
I've seen a few sub ohm nic salt juices that are labeled as like 0.3 milligrams up salt nicotine instead of like 3mg of Freebase, but they really don't hit the same as regular free base in a sub ohm.
Salt nicotine generally works best in the small pod systems because it gives the most similar feeling to smoking a cigarette and the tight cigarette-style draw and the size of the device systems mimics that.
Customers are always wary about nic salts because of the high strengths when they're used to vaping freebase, since the strengths are so different. But they ARE different, so they're measured differently. I think it's important that more people know that, and aren't scared of trying out nic salts.
Salt nicotine doesn't last as long. It's metabolized faster, so it takes effect faster, but it also wears off faster. It's one reason some people prefer freebase.
It's good in pod systems because there's almost no throat hit. Vaping freebase at the concentrations people use for pods would be unpleasant. Also like you said it takes effect faster.
Why the huge cost differences between Freebase and Nic Salts?
A 60mL bottle of freebase at my work costs about $33 after tax and a 30ml bottle of nic salts it's $22 after tax. Nic salts are supposed to last longer, and they're stronger. I'm assuming that's why.
and the cost of buying pre-filled pod replacements will always run a little bit higher because you're paying for convenience as well.
I sub-ohm and DIY all my juice ( thanks to this community ) and use exclusively freebase mixes of 50/50 to 70/30 based on recipes of 12% Freebase Nic. I'd like to experience Nic Salts but I haven't researched the conversion of 12% FB Nic to 12% Salts.
Still learning, it's why I'm here now.
It's different, despite everyone here stating otherwise. 10ml of <freebase nicotine> is 10ml of the nicotine molecule. 10ml of <freebase nicotine + salt> is 10ml worth of the nicotine+salt molecule. The salt takes a percentage of the total weight. What that weight is, no bloody idea. I always use double with nic salts as I do with freebase.