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"Tempering" mixes and my thoughts on mixing
submitted about 8 years ago by jklavins

So I really don't like the term "steeping" haha these aren't tea bags! I would rather say homogenize or cure.

Either way, Tempering, like when you are cooking, you use a little bit of a hot liquid to gradually bring the temperature up, while being able to not prematurely cook or overheat ingredients.

Like tempering in cooking, but without heat at all, I mix the Nic and the flavorings first, then add a couple ml of VG, mix, then a little more VG and mix, etc. until the desired volume is reached. My thinking is that the VG and PG or flavorings are the parts that have the most difficulty blending quickly, so might as well introduce smaller amounts of the thicker substance (VG) into a larger quantity of the thinner (PG and flavoring) you will "water down" the stubborn VG and slowly introduce it to more of itself by adding VG bit by bit and it should blend/homogenize/cure faster.

What are your thoughts?

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7 points
 
by EdibleMalfunctionabout 8 years agoThat Sugar Cookie Guy

It's all getting shaken up at the end. I'm not sure your technique would have any advantage over mixing it all at once. But if it works for you, cool. Also, we all know it's not steeping. Everyone is fully aware that this process is not "steeping" in the normal sense of the word. But that's what it's called.

2 points
 
by vApe_Escapeabout 8 years agoTobacconist

I could see it if you were working with high final mg/ml, 100% vg nic and max vg juice. Mix your nicotine with your PG based flavorings to dilute the nic a bit and then add your VG base so its thinner and easier to prevent hotspots with inadequate mixing but even then if you mix well it shouldn't be an issue. I don't see it helping with PG being added to the mix or even just pg based nic.

The reason you temper food, like eggs for example, is because you don't want to overheat the eggs. Tempering chocolate, while different, still utilizes managing heat since the crystallization is very heat sensitive. Tempering really has nothing to do with adding a thick liquid gradually to achieve more uniformity with thinner liquids. I guess what OP is doing is much closer to "folding" but even that isn't really a proper analogy since folding is most often done to maintain the structural integrity of the base.

5 points
 
by project_twenty5oh1about 8 years agoMixologist

I cook everything I mix, set to a specific protocol I have worked out, and it's different for every flavor I currently sell.

Viscosity is a big factor in accelerating the arrival of a finished product (whether you call it steeping, aging, curing, tempering, etc), as well as heat promoting offgassing.

Basically it speeds up the entire process, and while you can over-do it, if you control the process you can wind up with a finished product sooner, and potentially a finished product you can't get by preparing it any other way.

In terms of specific timing, I add all flavor first, then stir in the VG in thirds to get it up to temperature and mixing faster.

3 points
 
by Civinskoabout 8 years ago

Would it be too much asking you to expand on those specific protocols? Sounds interesting!

2 points
 
by project_twenty5oh1about 8 years agoMixologist

The home version is to raise the temps to between 75-80c and sustain it there, while mixing, for an extended period of time, and allowing it to cool to near room temp before bottling.

I use one of these: https://www.amazon.com/Scilogex-86143101-MS-H280-Pro-Circular-Top-Magnetic/dp/B00AYGIFCA

Once temperature is reached: https://i.imgur.com/4NWmbeN.jpg

Four hours later: http://i.imgur.com/wsUfL3f.jpg

As you can see the color has changed significantly, and to the extent one would expect with a well "steeped" juice.

It also remedies some of the unpleasant volatiles by allowing them to escape as gas coming off the flask.

3 points
 
by Apexifiedabout 8 years agoSuckling from the teats of Daenerys Targaryen

What about the precious volatiles escaping?

2 points
 
by RamboUnchainedabout 8 years agoMixologist

So, you kept that juice heated and stirring for 4hrs straight before letting it cool? I don't have a stir plate, but I do have an ultrasonic cleaner that goes to around 73-75C that I use for warming my VG before mixing it.

2 points
 
by vApe_Escapeabout 8 years agoTobacconist

Do you think an immersion circulatory would work? You can set the temp to whatever and the water around it is in constant motion but I am not sure if it would be enough.

1 points
 
by Civinskoabout 8 years ago

Cool, thank you!

2 points
 
by WorstAdviceROCabout 8 years ago

Finally, someone gets it! I've got some research upcoming you may be interested in. Do you want your juice ran through a GCMS @ different time intervals and temps? I was originally planning on just testing flavor dilutions, mainly due to the published ingredients being a known starting point (TFA). See, my palate is shit and so are my mixes. You, however, know your stuff inside and out.

2 points
 
by project_twenty5oh1about 8 years agoMixologist

That sounds interesting, hit me up with details.

5 points
 
by VAPORMARKabout 8 years agoProud Sidebar Reader!

My thoughts:

Ain't nobody got time for that

4 points
 
by madscilabsabout 8 years ago

I add my VG all at once, but I heat it as it stirs to lower the viscosity of the VG, and I stir it for several minutes.

The temperature and vigorous stirring does reduce the steep time significantly. I'm sure the "steeping" process is a combination of a few things, namely: the gradual dispersion/homogenisation of the all the flavour compounds into the VG, chemical reactions between the different compounds, and off-gassing of volatile compounds.

Heat generally speeds up all of these, and vigorous/thorough mixing speeds up the homogenisation, and results in a more consistent tasting product from bottle to bottle.

My flavours which once required a week-long steep can be accelerated to about a 48 hours so long as the proper care is taken when mixing.

Magnetic stirrers and proper glass beakers are great for this. You can mix up a batch, set it to mix, and go on doing something else while it blends and off gasses for awhile, as opposed to sealing it up in a little bottle and having to shake your guts out.

If one doesn't want to spring for a magnetic stirrer, it's possible to engineer a simple mixer by taking a cheap milk frother from your local wal-mart, dollar store, etc, and fixing it to something with zip ties so that it points downwards. Set your container of juice underneath it so that the frother tip is submerged, turn it on and walk away. If you want to add heat - put the juice container inside of a mixing bowl with a hot water bath.

1 points
 
by PM_ME_YOUR_JDM_CARabout 8 years ago

Doesn't the frother have the side effect of introducing massive amounts of air into your ejuice? That is what it is designed to do.

1 points
 
by madscilabsabout 8 years ago

It was designed to do that in milk, which is considerably less viscous than VG.

In VG it spins far more slowly, essentially making it into a mixer, especially when used at its low speed setting.

The only time you will introduce bubbles in your juice is if you use it near the surface of the juice on high speed, where it will encounter less resistance and spin up more.

3 points
 
by BuryMeInSmokeabout 8 years ago

Yeah, it makes sense. I do the same thing but only two additions of VG - does make quite a big difference over just dumping everything in and giving it one big shake.

I mix nic (70/30PG), flavourings, and my PG, shake the hell out of it. Add half my VG, shake, the other half of the VG, shake.

1 points
 
by jklavinsabout 8 years ago

Yeah, I mix all VG aside from Nic and flavorings, and I usually add 5-8 ml of VG between each shake, so it is only 3-5 times per 30 ml bottle

3 points
 
by leapinglabratsabout 8 years ago

The only time I mess with pure VG is when I premix it 7:3 with PG. Viscosity is not an issue when mixing with that.

3 points
 
by OpiumPhroggabout 8 years ago

Sometimes I take a mix and shake it for a good 3 - 5 minutes then I will set my electric kettle to 140 degrees and pour some of that water into a dish deep enough to cover the bottle and let the bottle soak for about 7-10 minutes, then I will shake it again and let it sit until it goes to room temp.

Is this a bad thing? So far I haven't noticed any difference in flavor.

2 points
 
by Gtoman88about 8 years ago

I use a lot of tanks to vape,so to me my pg/vg ratio isn't as critical. I take a condiment bottle and premix my pg and vg at approximately 80/20. After adding nic and flavorings I just top the bottle off with my pg/vg mix. Recipe maturity is cut in half on most steeping times. My personal preference though.

2 points
 
by simpleone234about 8 years agoMixologist

Commercially speaking, we put everything in and mix it. Turns out fine. When I mix for myself, I put everything in and mix it as well. Turns out great. If you want it to blend or mix better, add flavorings first, then PG, and shake/mix that before introducing the VG, although if you have a good mixer, it won't matter.

2 points
 
by wh1skeyk1ngabout 8 years agoThanks for reading this flair

I'm all for aging in a cupboard naturally with time and a dark cool space. Heating shit only seems to make my batches lose flavor and/or oxidize. I still haven't been able to wrap my head around why this method is so hyped unless you're vaping the entire bottle immediately.

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