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Has anyone found less steeping to be BETTER?
submitted almost 9 years ago by mpglax

Hey folks, I recently started making my own juice. Of course, I've read about all the merits of steeping on here and have patiently been steeping my recipes, and trying them as I go. I discovered a recipe that I really like--a creamy, cherry, nutty recipe. After a 4 day steep it was fantastic. I wrote "Perfect!" in my notes and was ready to let it be. After 2 weeks of steeping, I actually think it went downhill. The flavors mellowed down, are less distinct from each other, and it's just not what it was 10 days ago. Has anyone else found this to be the case and/or can anyone cite a reason for this?

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8 points
 
by wh1skeyk1ngalmost 9 years agoThanks for reading this flair

Anything with TFA Peanut Butter seems way better for the first week than it does after 2 or 3 weeks.

3 points
 
by Zateticsalmost 9 years agoDiketones, Schmiketones

anything with TFA banana cream also tastes better the less you steep.

1 points
 
by gorillafalmost 9 years ago

Unless it's the DX version ;)

1 points
 
by wh1skeyk1ngalmost 9 years agoThanks for reading this flair

TFA Banana Cream is a tough one for me. I hate it for the first 2 or 3 weeks, contemplate dumping it, throw it in the back of the cupboard, and around the 2 month mark I finally find it somewhat enjoyable.

1 points
 
by Zateticsalmost 9 years agoDiketones, Schmiketones

I find super low percentages (sub 1%) still shine through after a few days. I like the subtle banana hint at the back but when it overpowers i cant stand the juice anymore.

2 points
 
by Enyawreklawalmost 9 years agoCreator - Best Recipe of 2015: Rhodonite

truth

2 points
 
by BlazeDemBeatzalmost 9 years agoMentholatier

I feel like CAP NY Cheesecake v2 is better before it gets a long steep. I made a recipe. With it. Tried a tank of it after a few days and it was awesome. So I made 150ml and figured I'll let it sit. Let it sit for 2 months and It turned a super healthy yellow colour but It was nowhere near as amazing as the initial test when it was slightly clear. I always see ppl say v2s need a really long steep but I don't know maybe it was a personal taste thing.

Anything with a main Lime note seems to dull out too after a while.

1 points
 
by DaB0mb0almost 9 years agoMixologist

Same with CAP PBv2

8 points
 
by RRjralmost 9 years ago

It's all in the chemistry.

Some flavors contain more highly volatile compounds so they usually end up being your "shake and vape". Also, you might get certain reactions between them which then also changes the flavor profile sometimes only slightly, sometimes drastically. There's a lot going on in that bottle once you mix all this stuff up.

This is why generally blue / brown glass bottles with sealing screw-caps are your friend.

But even with glass bottles you're going to have mixes that you don't want to have sitting around for long.

More steep is not always better. Every mix has its sweet spot where it tastes its best. For some mixes this is after a day or even right after mixing it up, while others can take weeks to develop and then last for months or even longer. Yet others come into their own after a week and then change profile again as time goes on.

You made the most important step to tackle this "problem" already: Taking notes.

Knowing how your mixes behave over time via taking those notes allows you to schedule your batches accordingly, or even change the recipe in a way that may extend shelf life.

2 points
 
by T_Macealmost 9 years agoresident tobacco specialist

Any tips on extending shelf life?

3 points
 
by RRjralmost 9 years ago

Few pointers based on my experience so far:

  1. As mentioned, use blue or brown glass bottles. Don't use the dropper caps on them. Use normal caps instead for a good seal.

  2. Take notes. Know when your mix hits that sweet spot and how long it'll stay there.

  3. Once #2 is figured I just make sure to schedule batches so I can vape that shit right when it tastes its best. I also heard you can prolong that period quite a bit by putting the juice in the fridge but I never tested myself so your YMMV. In any case I'd make sure not to store it too cold because I'd guess super low temperatures might also mess with the flavor compounds.

  4. I usually make batches of 200ml in 50ml bottles. Once I start vaping on a bottle I'll shake it up good, then transfer 20ml of it into a dropper glass bottle that I use to top up the tank / RDA. This is not only more convenient and less messy (you only need one 20ml bottle, just wash it when you change flavors). You minimize air circulation on the rest of the juice since you only open the 50ml bottle three times max to refill the 20ml one.

  5. The 200ml batches I make usually consist of one 50ml "shake and vape". The other three take between one to three weeks to steep. So by the time I went through the first bottle the other ones will hit their peak and stay there for at least two months. They'd probably last longer but never make it that far ;)

Hope this helps.

1 points
 
by T_Macealmost 9 years agoresident tobacco specialist

Cheers, thanks for the detailed response! This is great for my personal supply. I was also curious if there was ways to increase shelf life for commercially sold eliquid but maybe not I guess. Just gotta choose the right flavorings probably.

2 points
 
by mlNikonalmost 9 years ago

I have found cutting back on the percentages definitely extends shelf life. Sometimes having too much flavor can make your mix fall apart in the steep. What I used to do when I had a mix I was happy with after a shake was cut everything in half and most of the time it ended up having more flavor and steeping better.

1 points
 
by T_Macealmost 9 years agoresident tobacco specialist

That is fucking brilliant, thank you I will try it!

1 points
 
by Taclitealmost 9 years ago

I believe sticking it in the fridge will slow down the aging significantly.

1 points
 
by T_Macealmost 9 years agoresident tobacco specialist

Ya true. I was more referring to 'for commercial purposes' tho.

1 points
 
by mpglaxalmost 9 years ago

Thanks for the reply. I tried another batch in which i diversified the flavors a bit and increased total flavor from 15% to 18%. Maybe this will have a better shelf life.

5 points
 
by Burritoclockalmost 9 years ago

Yes, all the time. It's a hurdle if you are trying to create recipes with shelf life.

3 points
 
by DGsirb1978almost 9 years ago

It just all depends on the particular flavors used, yes sometimes there are juices that fade or get slightly worse with a steep, but that's unusual

2 points
 
by 0ptimusRhymealmost 9 years ago

Care to share that recipe? It sounds like something I'd enjoy! PM if your prefer keeping it private. No biggy if you're not up for sharing it!

2 points
 
by mpglaxalmost 9 years ago

Yea I'd be happy to share. This is the original recipe that i found didnt age very well. It is tasty though after only a couple of days!

65 VG/ 35 PG FW bavarian cream 2%, FW cherry crush 4%, INA vanilla 5%, FA almond 4%

I haven't played with different flavor brands much yet, those are just the ones I've got.

1 points
 
by 0ptimusRhymealmost 9 years ago

Thank you! I'll have to get cherry crush but I'll def mix it up when I have everything

1 points
 
by mpglaxalmost 9 years ago

Thats the only cherry Ive got. I think black cherry would also work well in this. Let me know how you like it!

1 points
 
by CheebaSteebaalmost 9 years agoFrugivore

+1 I think that sounds pretty darn tasty!

2 points
 
by cloudCRAFT3RSalmost 9 years ago

I find it all depends on the recipe. Sometimes different flavors disappear in long steep, while others get stronger so. Rule of thumb for me is make one long steep and one s&v and see which one I prefer and note the changes

2 points
 
by robotbeatrallyalmost 9 years ago

I'm pretty much only into shake n vape to 48 hour steep recipes. I don't really like the sticky/sweet VG flavor that comes through when something has been steeping for over a week. Purely personal preference though I know. If I have a flavor I know that just doesn't taste good without a long steep sometimes I'll mix it in first and wait a week, then mix in the other ingredients and shake n vape it. Maybe I'm crazy but i just rarely like my juice well steeped.

1 points
 
by Lulzorralmost 9 years ago

I find tfa swedish gummy seems to taste best around 4-5 days but it doesn't really fall of too much past then. Though, I love it so much 30ml doesn't last longer than a couple days after the steep.

1 points
 
by BlazeDemBeatzalmost 9 years agoMentholatier

Anytime I use that the smell sticks to the tank forever.

1 points
 
by sunburndalmost 9 years ago

I have one that uses TFA Apple Pie + FA Fuji that just doesn't steep well after more than 3 weeks.

In the end you end up with a nice crust and no apple if you wait too long.

1 points
 
by koniferusalmost 9 years agoMixologist

I diy as needed and shake and vape everything immediately, so at this point I think I've just learned to mix things that will taste well without steeping. Actually, I'd say my mixes would taste worse after steeping.

1 points
 
by dirtysamsquamptshalmost 9 years ago

For the most part, the juices I make seem to taste best as a shake and vape and most of those taste the same a week or two down the road. I suppose for those that don't work well after a while, I could tweak the recipe, but since I make a bottle or two at a time and go through them pretty quickly, I don't see putting in too much effort to do much about it.

1 points
 
by RinVapesalmost 9 years ago

This can happen unfortunately. This happened recently with a Rasta Blood clone I was working on. The original mixture had steeped about a week, then I added another cream and a different white chocolate to try to improve it. It tasted great right away so I let it steep for another week or so. The strawberry that was perfect prior to adding the other creams was almost completely gone. That was the first time I have experienced anything quite like that. My suspicion is that with certain flavors that taste great right away but then degrade over time, were too high of a percentage... Too much flavoring can result in less actual flavor (which is an odd concept but true). Other than that, maybe certain flavorings break down too much after steeping? It's hard to say.

1 points
 
by engmiaalmost 9 years agoOne of "The Damned"

Yes I've heard people reporting it.

It usually means you have to tweak the recipe, and it's just part of the art of mixing. Getting the perfect recipes so it tastes good after sitting for at least a couple of months on the shelf.

1 points
 
by DarkJester89almost 9 years ago

Sometimes it can happen with some fruits, the flavors smooth out or blend and settle down. I think Citrus Punch is one of them that after about 3-4 weeks, it settles, might be because alcohol is a carrier in the original citrus punch, Citrus Punch II might not have it though. I make small batches for this purpose, thats just my opinion though.

1 points
 
by surfishermanalmost 9 years ago

I have been toying around with Medicine Flower flavorings and it seems steeping them wipes out the flavor but it's most likely my horrific mixing skills .

I don't think these flavors work well with other flavor brands either.

2 points
 
by robotbeatrallyover 8 years ago

I like most of the MF flavors the morning after mixing them myself. They seem to be pretty heat sensitive which is weird.

1 points
 
by surfishermanover 8 years ago

You are probably right , i am still toying around with them .

1 points
 
by barbarake21almost 9 years ago

It totally depends on the flavors. As a general rule, tobaccos and custards/creams taste better after steeping. (Yes, I know it's not technically 'steeping' but that's the term everyone uses.) Fruits not so much. Some flavors (citrus, spices) tend to fade with steeping. (A way around this is to simply use more flavoring knowing that it will fade with age.) Some flavors (TFA blueberry extra) only become apparent after aging.

In many cases, flavorings that contain alcohol taste better after being opened and exposed to air for a day or so for the alcohol to evaporate off. (Hint, many flavorings contain alcohol but it's not always apparent which ones they are.)

As you can see, there's no hard-and-fast rules.

In your particular case, someone else might like your same liquid after it's 'mellowed down'.

1 points
 
by king_cheefer_420over 8 years ago

I like custard flavors fresh. If I get them I get them in 30mls only so I can enjoy them before they "steep" cause after that I don't care for them at all!

0 points
 
by Reldofalmost 9 years ago

Yes, some volatiles escape very easily every time you open your bottle. to me the most knows ones are the Super Concentrate flavorings, such as their mango.

-1 points
 
by Ziserainalmost 9 years ago

Too much flavoring ?

2 points
 
by RinVapesalmost 9 years ago

^^this is the culprit most of the time, I would say. JMO

-4 points
 
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