In light of the few post asking about menthol and other cooling agents

submitted almost 9 years ago by firefoxwhyyounoworkOne of "The Damned"

There have been a number of posts asking about how to impart a cool or cold feeling to juice.

I have come across a rather interesting article about cooling agents

TL:DR

Koolada (cooling agent WS 3) and Cooling agent WS 23 ( the one apparently used in Malaysian juices) impart cooling/coldness without imparting minty flavor and bitterness associated with menthol.
Koolada is 150% the strength of menthol and cooling agent ws 23 is only 75% the strength of menthol.
These two concentrates can also impart the impression of saltiness.
If you mix both together they get colder.

Comments

11 points

by CranberryMarcusalmost 9 years ago

Let me shed a bit of light on WS-23 usage in juice mixing: I performed tests on 10% PG solution and 20% PG solution. 10% solution didn't work out in terms of the effect I wanted to get, it was too weak and required too big percentage to get it working. But 20% solution - if used at more than 5,5% and up to 6,5% - you'll get the beginning of cooling sensation present in Malaysian juices. If we'll add 2-2,5% Koolada with 5-5,5% WS-23 20% PG solution, then we'll achieve the exact strong cooling effect present in Malaysian juices. For me, that's too overpowering, and Koolada brings kinda "soapy" flavour when I'm using it even below 0,5%, so I use 2-3% of 20% WS-23 solution when I want to get a nice cooling effect. As a bonus - it doesn't mute, affect or weaken the resulting flavour at all nor it doesn't bring any side flavours to the table. I'd definitely recommend adding it to your milkshake or lemonade to make it refreshing and when you don't want any Koolada. WS-23 crystals are easily soluble in PG, you can even heat PG up to 40-45 C when diluting, but use extreme caution when working with crystal powder - wear gloves ALL times and work in a mask, because crystals are very tiny and are carried by air really good, you don't want it on your skin or in nasal cavities (it causes a heavy irritation). Sorry for formatting - on mobile.

1 points

by firefoxwhyyounoworkalmost 9 years agoOne of "The Damned"

Thanks that is some solid info about the crystals.

Your findings are very interesting maybe do a flavor review of it, I think that would be very helpful

1 points

by cooperCollinsalmost 9 years ago

The muting is why I stopped using Koolada. I really like the cooling that Menthol gives, but it has a flavor that I don't always want in my mixes. Thanks for your write-up, it's helped a lot.

1 points

by thedirtyprojectoralmost 9 years agoMixologist

Hey sorry, what do you mean by 20% PG solution? Do you mean diluting the cooling agent?

2 points

by CranberryMarcusalmost 9 years ago

Yeah. Dilute it to 20% in PG (in 10g of solution 2g of the cooling powder). Take 2% as a starting point to use the solution in your mix.

1 points

by thedirtyprojectoralmost 9 years agoMixologist

If I purchased it in liquid form, is it still necessary to dilute?

6 points

by deckartcainalmost 9 years ago

Any good leads on where to get ws 23?

1 points

by keed_spillsalmost 9 years ago

Drip Hacks

2 points

by DirkDeadeyealmost 9 years ago

I prefer koolada, it's more of a subtle backnote, rather than menthol which is more robust, and sort of infuses with the flavoring.

2 points

by firefoxwhyyounoworkalmost 9 years agoOne of "The Damned"

TBH I like both I just think that work better in different places.

1 points

by DirkDeadeyealmost 9 years ago

Personally I could see it with a tobacco flavor. I vape fruits, and mentholated fruit only works with strawberry.

2 points

by firefoxwhyyounoworkalmost 9 years agoOne of "The Damned"

have u tried mentholated blueberry, I love me some blueberry menthol. It was one of the first liquids I got when I started vaping so I could be biased.

2 points

by tranceinatealmost 9 years agoIn a good mood for now - don't piss me off.

All you need to know about WS type cooling compounds is in /r/deeper_diy

4 points

by firefoxwhyyounoworkalmost 9 years agoOne of "The Damned"

The initial /r/deeper_diy post is what put me on to WS 23 and it was a really great article about cooling agents.

However where it gave relative cooling value for lots of cooling agents compared to Menthol it did not give a figure for WS 23 and that is what I was personally looking for and this one did so I thought to share it.

2 points

by joeongalmost 9 years ago

here are some inputs from a malaysian pure cold juice diy vaper!

Most malaysian cooling use 1:20pg ratio. @1:10 ratio and maybe 5% the instant u vape it you get a literal brain freeze effect (like chugging down an ice smoothie) <- man i love this feeling
Koolada mutes/changes flavor more than cooling agent 23
Cooling Agent 23 gives a cold throat hit sensation/irritation to those who arent used to it.
Cooling 23 does not mute flavors @ 3% and below. Above 3% (4-8%) the cooling sensation gets slightly harsher/cooler and "numbs the tongue abit" so flavors come out less prominently

Also can i get some opinions please? as im trying to introduce some juices to the us, russian & european market, do you guys like your juices cold? (its hot here all year round so lotsa people love cold juices) How does it feel vaping koolada in winter?

1 points

by Gushluvaalmost 9 years ago

Thanks for the information. Malaysian juices are pretty popular over here. Nasty juice is pretty big, I've tried 3 from their line they have all been good. Will try my luck replicating Devil Teeth, their honeydew flavor. As I understood from you that they maybe using local malaysian flavourings. Any local website that might carry a few?

1 points

by thedirtyprojectoralmost 9 years agoMixologist

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