Why is my juice harsh? Why do I get a harsh throat from this recipe? My mix tastes great, but it’s a little too harsh.
These are questions that get asked a lot, here in reddit, in facebook groups, pretty much anywhere you encounter DIY E-juice it seems. It’s quite possibly the most irritating thing about making juice. I know I suffered from this when I first started crafting recipes, and was having trouble finding the answers I needed. I thought I remembered someone posting a thread about this, but wasn’t able to easily find it, so I hope this is beneficial and easy to locate for some people who are seeking answers to these questions. TL;DR below for all you lazy f@@@ers like me
I will try to outline some of the tips and techniques I’ve found for determining where the harsh throat is coming from, and how to--hopefully--avoid it.
##1.) YOUR NICOTINE##
9 times out of 10, if you ask this question, people will blame the nicotine; 9 times out of 10, those people are right. The absolute first thing you should do when experiencing a harsh throat, if you haven’t already, is make a flavorless nicotine juice. You should start at your preferred nic strength & PG/VG Ratio, but it might be a good idea to do high or max VG to test it (possible base irritation, covered later). If it’s harsh, you know right away what your problem is, and you don’t have to waste more resources trying to figure out what’s wrong. There is a lot of information on nicotine and possible ways to remedy it, but this isn’t about that.
2.) Single Flavor Testing
In being a good boy and doing more single flavor tests, I’ve realized this is a huge benefit in finding where the harsh throat might be coming from. Usually when single flavor testing, you use the ingredient at its maximum recommended %, which will give you a good idea of all of the properties the flavoring has to offer. By doing this, you will be able to determine the level of throat you’re getting from individual flavorings, which will help you determine what might be causing the harsh throat in your recipe.
If you have the resources, it’s a good idea to test the ingredient at multiple different %s to find the range that is suitable to your throat needs. Generally speaking, the higher %s you use, the sharper the throat will be. I also highly recommend mixing with nicotine (if you use nicotine), as the components together will help simulate any sensation and end flavor you get from a completed recipe more accurately.
3.) Personal Sensitivity
As I’m sure most of you have realized by now, we as human beings are all unique individuals. A throat I find satisfying, might be too harsh or sharp for you and vice versa. I know /u/Vurve and /u/Matthewkocanda have a love/hate relationship with the delicious flavor and oh-so-unpleasant throat of TFA Juicy Peach, which I believe spawned this post on TFA Juicy Peach harshness by /u/abdada. He covered it much better than I could ever hope to.
Basically, there might be compounds in certain flavorings or flavor profiles that you are sensitive to, and will lead to a harsh throat or other unpleasantness in your vape. Due to this, most flavorings of a certain profile will probably offer similar irritation, and will be very difficult for you to avoid. You might be able to find certain flavorings that don’t irritate you quite as much, or even stumble on a like profile (i.e. apricot instead of peach), but it will not be an easy task.
For me, I just avoid certain flavor profiles I know might be irritants to me. Maybe somewhere down the line you'll find a good substitution.
4.) Flavor Pairing
So you’ve done your nic tests, single flavor tests, determined you’re not particularly sensitive to anything, but your end mix is still harsh. What’s going on?
Keep in mind these different compounds are going to react with each other in a completed mix, so this may be your culprit here. Even if certain flavorings have a tolerable throat, mixing them together could enhance the throat and make it unpleasant.
Likewise, adding in a smooth cream, EM, mint/menthol, or some other additive/enhancer to a flavoring could tame the throat to a more enjoyable level.
5.) Steep
One thing I’ve become more and more aware of is how a steep affects the throat on a completed liquid. Some mixes I’ve noticed are unpleasant right away, but the throat mellows out over time. Others were great right away, but as it steeps the throat gets harsh or unpleasant. This is going to really depend on the mix obviously, but is definitely something to keep in mind.
Also, certain methods of steeping or “speed steeping” may affect the throat you achieve from a mix.
6.) Bases/Ratio
Lastly, if everything else doesn’t seem to provide an answer, I would look at my bases. This is more so for PG than it is VG, since there are quite a few people who are sensitive to PG and find it unpleasant (hence the “max VG” movement), myself included. Try a different ratio out, and it could calm the throat significantly.
I would also recommend testing your bases alone to determine if you’re getting any throat or off flavors to add to your knowledge base when crafting recipes.
##TL;DR
1.) YOUR NIC – Try a flavorless nic juice to test for nic harshness
2.) Single Flavor Testing – This will help you determine problem flavors
3.) Personal Sensitivity – Maybe your body doesn’t like peach yo
4.) Flavor Pairing – Different combos may tame/enhance throat
5.) Steeping – Lengths and methods of steeping may affect throat
6.) Bases/Ratio – Try different ratios & try your bases
Anyway, I hope this is helpful to someone. It can be a very discouraging problem, and it doesn’t help when the only answer you seem to find is, “dood its ur nic.” Especially if you know your nic is good.
Any other tips, tricks, or info on throat management is certainly appreciated.
Very well written sir!
Guess I can cross this one off my list for now.
I'll just copy/paste it into a Modest Monday 1 month from now when no one is searching :)
Good post.
In my experience, sometime's you just stumble upon a flavor that is more 'harsh' than others. It might be your personal sensitivity to it, but there are definitely flavors out there that have a sharper taste, which can result in harshness. I find a lot of the tobacco types to have this effect on me. It might just be me personally, but I doubt it.
Reverse question: What do you do when you want more throat hit but don't necessarily want to load on nic? I think the highest I could vape in a tank is 6mg and dripping like 4mg..
I sometimes mess with PG ratios but it doesn't feel the same.
I've heard of adding ethanol to increase throat hit, haven't tried it myself. I'd recommend 1 drop of everclear/10ml at a time till you get what you want.
There is a flavoring or additive made by FA called Flash that is supposed to mimic the throat you might get from nicotine. I'd start there for trying to up your throat hit
Wowowowow. You're all blowing my mind, how did I not know this existed?
I LOVE tfa strawberry ripe but can't vape it because I'm sensitive to it.
Well said. I never thought much of steeping, as most of my juices came out tasty right away, and only got better. Then I made much bigger mixes and there is now a huge difference in throat hit after a week or so.
How big are we talking? Do you make the large batches with nicotine in them?
Not huge, like 120-200. But going up from 30s and 50s there is a noticeable difference
I gotcha. Yeah if I were mixing up 100ml+ I would probably do it without nic, and then dispense into a smaller bottle, add the nic, and then be off to the races. Simply because I only go through 5-10ml a day and I switch it up all the time, so I know the nicotine would see too much oxygen over time.