Back in January, Skiddlz posted a helpful attempt to Mythbust some of the nonsense in DIY. Which Kirkt, and I, shat on because we're both strong believers in the value of speed steeping / heated aging.
Skiddlz responded to my criticism with a statement:
> Steeping as it is produces an ideal product with a shelf life of 6 months to a year. The most I've been able to get out of a "speed-steeped" juice is 2 months before it became garbage.
I decided to do my part for BroScience by putting a "Save for April" label on an old batch I'd speed steeped. It is now April and I'm sad to report that Skiddlz was indeed right.
This is fucking awful. TL;DR: light volatiles are all gone, heavy volatiles are too heavy.
It was hard to get the color qualities photographed so I held it up to a light. The color has only slightly darkened, and I was expecting it to taste great. I was deeply disappointed with the results. Let's break down the recipe and try to figure out what went wrong.
This is my Matthew McConaughKKK that has failed to gain any popularity here, but which I still insist is the best juice ever.
Ingredient|% :---|---: DX Vanilla Cupcake (TPA)|4 Joy (FA)|0.75 Marshmallow (FA)|2 Vanilla Bean Gelato (TPA)|3 Vanilla Bourbon (FA)|2 Vanilla Classic (FA)|2 Vanilla Custard v2 (CAP)|2
This tastes like a velvety vanilla cupcake (all that stacked vanilla + Marshmallow) with frosting (small percentage of Vanilla Custard) and sprinkles (Joy + Vanilla Bean Gelato). It requires a lengthy steep. I cheat and give it a hot water bath at 160°F for 48 hours, with clingwrap covering the beaker to keep the volatiles in. I then let it sit in a cupboard for at least 3 days. The end result is the only bakery flavor I can ADV. It's a delicate mix of slightly different flavors, such that not even the custard will overpower everything else. Even after all of my abusive heating!
However, after approximately 4 months it has lost all of its delicacy. All of the lighter flavors have absconded. Both Vanilla Classic (FA) and Vanilla Bourbon (FA) are just gone. The sprinkles, or sweetness from Joy, are almost entirely lost. The DX Vanilla Cupcake (TPA) is all that really remains, and it tastes like someone over-baked a cupcake. It's weird. I swear it tastes exactly like that too. Not burned, just over-baked.
This leads me to believe that the speculation about lighter volatiles being cooked off may have some weight. It just doesn't make any sense. This bottle has been capped since January, kept in a dark cupboard, at ~70°F. How did the light volatiles that were in there escape the juice in that time?
I didn't make a control batch that was un-heated, because in my hubris I expected the result of this to be totally fine. You should wait for Kirkt's more scientific results, which should be coming out soon. I'm going to keep heat steeping this and just make sure I suck down all that delicious juice before it gets to be 4 months old!
TL;DR: Tried to prove Sidebar wrong. Waited six months, Sidebar was right. /u/skiddlzninja head inflates.
Plot twist, skiddlz takes this as proof he is the second coming of Walter White. /r/DIY_meth is created.
... Checkmate athiests.
4 points 20 minutes ago
The 4 month old bottle has a lot of empty space. I would try it again with full glass amber bottles. I left a bottle of Funfetti for two weeks half full in a plastic bottle and by the time I got back from a two week vacation the flavor was almost gone. My full 45mL bottle however was finely steeped and delicious
You may have just answered my question in all of this. That does make some amount of sense!
Certainly does. I was about to post the same. Juice tends to go bad faster in a bottle like that. Using amber glass does help, though.
You're also running it too hot for too long IMO.
Try dropping the temp down to 140F and stop heating after around 8 hours, a little more or less depending on flavor profile.
Beyond 140F you're gonna see reactions changing the composition of the juice significantly, whereas at 140F for 8 hours is almost identical to 2 weeks of normal steeping.
If you ran it at 160 for 48 hours and then left it in the cupboard... to me seems pretty much equivalent to vaping on some 1.5+ year old juice. Not really a surprise that it tastes bleh.
I personally share the belief that there's no (affordable) replacement for time, and that heating a mix beyond the minimum required to get the VG to homogenize is probably not a good idea.
That said...
Without a control, this unfortunately doesn't mean much. There may be something about the recipe that causes it to change this way over time no matter how it steeps.
Looking forward to Kirkt's similar test with a control batch for comparison.
> This leads me to believe that the speculation about lighter volatiles being cooked off may have some weight. It just doesn't make any sense. This bottle has been capped since January, kept in a dark cupboard, at ~70°F. How did the light volatiles that were in there escape the juice in that time?
The volatiles aren't escaping. They are being broken down. Take a piece of paper and a lighter. Burn the paper.
The paper didn't disappear, it was broken down and transformed.
Due to heat.
Due to heat.
I'll wait here for Abdada to give the more scientific answer.
Okay... Then why are they still in there after the heat steep? A batch that has been heated will still taste great up to at least a month, with all those delicate little molecules. It was only after sitting for months that they broke down or escaped.
I honestly don't think it needs a more scientific answer. It makes complete sense as is. Think about it, lighter volatiles that have less binding strength aren't able to hold up to a heat steep because, well, they simply "cook" out. Think about it like cooking with alcohol. Why don't we get drunk off of vodka sauce or a bourbon glaze, because it's boiled to cook the alcohol molecules out of the liquid. Same basic principal applies here. There's probably more chemistry to it than simply being "cooked out," but in simple terms, that's what is happening to lighter volatiles.
Ok you got me to try the recipe! By the way, is there a difference between vanilla bean gelato and vanilla bean ice cream?
Yummy, yummy Acetyl Propionyl.
Yeah there is a big difference! Neither tastes like ice cream.
VB Ice Cream tastes like melted butter. VB Gelato tastes sort of waxy and vanilla.
The waxy quality is what I'm using in this recipe to give Joy some punch. With VB Ice Cream it would probably taste fine, just with extra butter in your cupcake and less punch in your sprinkles.
Bet it's absorbing into the plastic then evaporating away on the outside surface.
You're getting downvoted, but you're not necessarily wrong.
LDPE and HDPE are both air permeable. If air can get in, anything smaller can get out.
Volatile compounds are stored in glass in laboratories for this precise reason.