Good morning folks, except for you strange Aussies and Euros...
Looking for anyone who can remember a recipe that was really florally or soapy due to overflavoring. Specifically non-fruits, but fruits work as well.
I'm doing some research on finding the true component cause of this issue and have some of my own data but it's really old and I don't know if I trust myself.
If you're a new DIYer, or an old one with notes from way back when, and you've ever made a soapy-florally mess that you resolved by cutting back on the flavor, please post your recipe as best as you remember it.
A.B.
Flv strawberry @ 1.5% is flowers to me, have not cut it back yet to try if lowering helps but based off other people's notes it's just me.
Inw strawberry is flowers @ 1% and again, haven't tried lowering it.
Inw shisha strawberry is flowers @ 3% same thing.
All single flavors, even after a week steep.
I'm going to try all 3 @ .5 tomorrow and I'll send you a pm.
Edit: PRSM juice "blue" is also a floral mess of a juice if you want commercial stuff.
The shisha strawberry is that way for me above 5% but the floral part gets better after a couple days of sitting.
I also have always got soapy or chemical taste from Cap cake batter at or above 3%
I'll try to find that bottle I mixed up last week :/
I had mixed up 3% cap sweet strawberry 3% tfa ripe strawberry 2% inw shisha strawberry 1% tfa dragonfruit
That turned out good after 2 days of sitting. Im not sure if was dragonfruit that helped the shisha or if thats just how it steeps. I like the flavor but need to play with it more.
Amazing, thanks!
10 diacetyls for you, sir /u/changetip
Why thank you. While we're on the subject can you perhaps tell me why tfa juicy peach and flv peach have a shitty chemical/burnt/rubber taste to me? Fa white peach doesn't as much. I've vaped commercial peach juice before but can't seem to find a good peach concentrate I like.
/u/elephantrainbows, abdada wants to send you a tip for 10 diacetyls (592 bits/$0.24). Follow me to collect it.
Bonus: 10 diacetyls GIF
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Ive never made one that was soapy/floral but I have bought a few. The ones that stand out are mt baker thug juice and seduce juice vanilla custard. Thug juice is pure dish soap that no amount of steeping could cure. Vanilla custard was faint vanilla and in your face flowers.
Hmm, did you order those with extra flavor shots?
The thug juice purchase was so long ago that I couldn't say for sure. The VC was recent and flavor shots wasn't an option that I seen so no on that one.
Curious! Thanks for checking in, I'll add that to my list. Doesn't help a ton since it doesn't list the concentrates but maybe I can figure out what is used in those e-liquids.
have 5 diacetyls on me /u/changetip
I'm just here to get that butter money.
I'd butter your money, baby.
Everything with TFA Grape Candy, TFA Grape Juice or even 0.5% INW Cactus is floral; TFA Honeydew is soapy AND floral.
That's all I remember right now.
That is super helpful, thank you!
Inhale 10 diacetyls on me /u/changetip
TFA Honeydew at >= 4%
TFA Coconut Extra >= 1%, dies down after prolonged steep. 3% stays soapy
- INW Dragonfruit 4%
- INW Cactus 1%
- TFA Honeysuckle 4%
I enjoyed this recipe a lot a few months ago so I gave a sample to all my friends. Got the same feedback from everyone that it tasted like soap. It's definitely the cactus. I love it at 1% in certain recipes but no matter what recipe I put it in at that percentage most of my friends taste soap. 0.8% seems to be the spot for them where you can taste the cactus but you don't get soap. Interesting enough I don't get soap from it until 2%.
Yep, INW Cactus for me stops at 0.5% or else that happens.
Thanks! have 10 diacetyls to taunt vapor joe with /u/changetip
It's always interesting to me how that works. Like why don't I taste soap at 1%? I will check the notebook when I get a chance and see if I can find anymore recipes that ended up tasting soapy
> Like why don't I taste soap at 1%?
This is what I am working on (at least, will start working on in June). My goal is to work out which volatiles are the soapiest, at what concentration, across a wide range of different palates, to try to help create a better platform for people to make better flavors.
My theory so far is that the soapy flavor comes from some of the toppest notes -- the ones with the lowest specific gravity and lowest boiling points. If true, this is why extended steep times can help reduce soapiness because those volatiles evaporate the fastest.
BUT -- if you add a fixative component (base notes, high specific gravity and high boiling point), those can anchor some of the top notes from room temperature evaporation, and no amount of steeping will help.
I recently started writing my own software to try to "estimate" components in a final eliquid based on what percentage of what concentrates are mixed. It's wildly inaccurate but I think I have a good grasp right now and if it all works in the long run, it would be an excellent piece of code to give to any of the code mixing app developers.
I would like to see a "warning warning warning" sign when people start creating recipes in an app based on a variety of input signals. Such as the recent TFA DX Sweet Cream post -- if you go over X% of butyrics acid in an e-liquid (based on entering a variety of concentrates), a warning sign should pop up saying "warning warning warning, vomit flavor approaching, reduce A, B and C concentrates to prevent vomit flavor."
I almost never use INW dragonfruit above 1%, shit is strong. I can't imagine 4%
Have you tried Cactus by itself? It can be a bit floral & green at times, but it's never been soapy.
Several months ago when I got Dragonfruit I tried it at 0.5%,1%, 2%, 3%, and 4% and wrote down notes. 1% was very very faint to me. 2% I could taste it and it was good but still not right. 3% was good but still a little light for standalone. 4% was flavorful and just perfect dragonfruity goodness. That honeysuckle mix is the only recipe I use it at 4% in. Otherwise I stick to 1-2% usually and 3% if I really want it to be in the forefront in a mix. It works fucking magical in a White gummy mix (shoutout to skiddz for the idea) at 3% for me. Perhaps I should revisit it standalone.
And yes sir! I've tried cactus by itself. It gets soapy for me above 2% for me otherwise I love it. I feel like my palette is weird though. For instance everyone raves about FLV VC and I wanted to love it so fucking bad but no matter what percentage all I got was a hint of Vanilla with some sort of spice. Also use FA honey at 0.4-0.5%, can't taste shit at anything below that haha
Non-fruity, I haven't had the issue with so much. The one that stands out to me is FA Blackberry - like vaping potpourri soap. It's really quite lovely, in that if I were making soap or room deodorizer, I would say, "Wow, I love this!"
In a juice at 5%? No amount of steep could make it good.
I'm certain that's true, I have the same issue with MF Blackberry -- anything over 0.1% brings a lot of green leaf flowery to a recipe.
Thank you! Suck down 10 diacetyls of mine for extra popcorn lung! /u/changetip
Mount Baker Vapor's Cola recipe (not DIY, I know) is exactly what you're describing. I don't know what made it that way, but the Cola flavor was spot on on the draw, but the aftertaste was floral and soapy and completely vile.
I don't know if that will help, but I hope so.
Not sure if this qualifies but the other night I threw together a sample batch of Strawberry Kiss (INW) 5% along with my established cream base. The SK was new to me and I had not tried it previously. Test batch was 6ml total, no nic. Shake shake drop on finger flavor test. It was the nastiest fucking flavor I ever concocted. Let it age 48hrs...still nasty. Either I used too much SK or the concentrate itself was bad. And I mention not qualifying because it wasn't really florally but did have a very slight soapy note.
I have made two mixes in my time of DIY which came out perfumey as fuck, to where I can't really vape it. The common culprit in both cases was TFA Guava. The recent recipe I had 8% TFA cantaloupe w 3% TFA watermelon and 2% ripe strawberry. Added in 2% Guava and it tastes like perfume with a slight backnote of fruit.
Might try a 50% dilution of the mix to see if I can salvage it.
FA Lychee at .5-1% in anything is like rinsing my mouth with Dawn or something. It's the only concentrate I've gotten soapy from yet.
Yes. I'm glad I only got a 10ml bottle of that to try it. Can't find a use for that soapy mess... that one and Summer Clouds are the two FA flavors that went in the bin.
Same here, & I only got it because a friend requested a Lychee vape. Noooooooope. Immediately went to the bottom of my bin, & then I ended up giving it away with some TFA Mary Jane to someone who wanted to make actual Soap bars with them.
TFA Blackberry over 5% is a gloral perfumey mess.
TFA BlackBerry should never be used over 1% - probably even .5%
yeah im aware lol i found out the hard way. ordered it early on in my mixing career, figured it was TFA so i did a 5% single flavor mix..... and it was fucking awful lol.
Most VapeWild fruit flavors has the soapy/florally effect. I remember their Pineapple, Kiwi Berry and a few others really struck me like this. They use simple single/two flavor mixes, you should be able to decode them. CAP Raspberry is extremely soapy at high concentrations (3%+).
Hope it helps.
TFA vbic, it's a sewage extract.
I thought that vbic is the same as vanilla custard but without acetoin. (per this page http://shop.perfumersapprentice.com/flavorsworkshop/custard.html )
Which is weird because I noticed a heck of a lot of recipes in here seem to use the vanilla custard. I wonder if that makes all the difference in the taste ....
FA Concord Grape is very floral.
FA Concord Grape has dozens upon dozens of negative reviews. I don't remember hearing that their White Grape was that much better. Try INW Grapes, it's a blend of green & purple grapes & it's very realistic. Best grape concentrate i've found yet.
I recently got INW Grapes, can you recommend a percentage? I don't remember exactly what I used last time but I tried to make a Grape creamcicle and it didn't come out too great.
TFA VBIC - mixture of soap & pepper at any %
FA JOY at any %- soap made of beer
INW Biscuit 1% upwards- A tasty biscuit, made of soap
FLV Blueberry - floral before steep, soapy after. Only used at 0.5-1%
FLV Milk & Honey - soapy after steep, have used in ranges from 1-4%
Don't know if this helps because no exact recipes, but this just came to mind, the same plasticy/play-doh note which I would also call soapy is in all of these:
- FA Lime Tahity Cold-Pressed - yucky notes never faded, even under 0.5% in any recipe
- CAP Chocolate Glazed Doughnut - Bronuts was a no, at 1% with something like an 8% mix of heavy creams and vanillas (cap custard, yellow cake, bavarian cream) diluted the note.
- CAP Lemon Meringue Pie - gone down from 15% solo to 8% in a mix (flv cream and custard, meringue, inw lemon all at 0.5-1%), note still sticks through.