great article, thanks for sharing, although, I totally disagree with:
3 . There is no reason at all for diacetyl itself to be used as a flavoring in e-liquids, and the FDA should simply ban the use of diacetyl as an e-liquid flavoring.
My basis: it tastes totally amazing. I am therefore pretty sure I will still be using Cap VC v1 and other similar yummilicious flavors. ;)
No diacetyl in cap vanilla custard v1. Only ap
Considering AP catalyzes into DA, it still contains diacetyl. Explains suicide bunnys diacetyl testing results even tho they "don't use diacetyl containing flavours"
This information isn't correct and I continue to see it propagated.
Depending on how you are compounding certain flavors that use acetoin, diacetyl as a byproduct/contaminant can be created, but if you leave acetoin or ap in a bottle full of vg/pg and nic there won't be spontaneous generation of diacetyl.
Another "somewhat" truthful article .
Every e juice from each manufacturer has widely varying amounts of diketones in them if they are not diketone free juices .
Five Pawns had levels considerably higher than real cigs while others may have lower.
I avoid diacetyl because it permanently scars lung tissue which can never be reversed , my basic common sense tells me thats something i should probably avoid .
Does permanent lung tissue scarring mean trouble , no it does not , nobody will know that for many many years in the future since most people who vape have vaped for three years or less.
That's too short of a time to reveal anything of substance , i worry more about AP than diacetyl anyway.
When there was a thread asking what age people are it was very telling :
The overwhelming majority of people on the e cig reddit forums are youngsters , mostly 20 and 30 year olds.
When i was that age i refused to listen to anything and did whatever i felt like doing when i felt like doing it , your mindset is completely different that young .
Do i wish now that i was not as careless and took things a little more seriously , yes i do because i have issues now that are clearly related to what i did back when i was that age.
It's part of growing up though , you live and learn lol.
Well put! I'm 35 and already regretting some of my past decisions.
Fix America's Mental Heath Care System if you want me to stop Vaping.
I vape to lower Anxiety
Why do I have to do that? Because America's mental health system isn't setup well enough to get a diagnosis on anyone for anxiety issues.
If I don't vape I will end up with some bigger issue or habit.
So Fuck anyone who is against it.
I don't give a shit if it gives me cancer in thirty years if I can have a half ass decent quality of life right now.
So, from that article I gathered this info:
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"For quality control purposes, the opening of microwave popcorn bags released 780 μg diacetyl/bag into the air as well as other VOCs... Tobacco smoke contains 300-430 μg diacetyl/cigarette." And up to 10.3 mg diacetyl per cubic meter is an accepted industrial exposure. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pu...
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In the study, Allen et al. found that the average diacetyl content of the products tested was 9.0 micrograms per e-cigarette cartridge. Assuming that a vaper uses one cartridge per day, the average daily inhaled dose of diacetyl associated with vaping is therefore 9.0 micrograms.
Essentially you could vape a "cartridge" everyday for 86 days, and get less diacetyl then smelling a freshly opened bag of microwave popcorn.
Sound about right?
A "cartridge" was around 1mL. So if you're vaping 10mL per day, you get that exposure in 8 days. If you are vaping 30mL per day (as many drippers do) you get that exposure in 2.
So remember the story about that crazy guy that got popcorn lung from having 2 microwave popcorns per day? Fear not, you're only inhaling a 1/4 of what he did! Seems legit...
As /u/surfisherman points out below: most folks here are too young to appreciate health risks in any form. You can keep huffing on all the DA/AP you like, more power to you, but please don't try to convince us (or yourselves) that this is somehow safe. Sometimes this subreddit feels like a bathhouse in the `80s trying to deny to themselves that there are any health risks with the behavior they are implicitly endorsing.
The massive increase in juice consumption that is so prevalent today with high wattage vaping and doing sub ohm is concerning if you choose to vape diketone loaded juices.
Again, your analysis is based on every e juice containing the same amount of diketones , since all e juices can vary widely there's no possible way to know just how much your getting unless you have every e juice you vape analyzed .
I think you need to go back and read that story again. He didn't just open the bag, releasing the figures stated, he liked to shove his fucking face into the bag and stand there breathing the fumes. His exposure was extreme. If you slam your face into a bag of steaming onions twice a day you'll probably contract some other disease.
I'm pretty sure most people around here argue against these studies that exaggerate these studies to make vaping seem worse than smoking.
Most will say its better than smoking but worse than breathing air which the studies are showing after sifting through all the exaggerated bs. I haven't seen many act like its a bathhouse in the 80s denying health risks exaggerating things like you just did claiming this reddit is denying the health risks.
If it's true that cigs have THAT much diacetyl in them, how come they don't taste like it?
Mostly combustion. Other chemicals obviously play a role in hiding any hint of anything tasting good.
I always toss the smoking vs vaping diketone argument straight out the window.
Reason being what you just stated, NotCharlesManson, combustion. Most of the diacetyl in a cigarette wouldn't stand the heat it's subjected to given that its boiling point is only 88 degrees celcius
Vaping and smoking are two totally different things and should be treated as such, comparing the effects of one to the other is like comparing apples to oranges.
So why should it be any different in terms of vaping? You're stating that the diacetyl in a cigarette would be "destroyed" by the heat given it's boiling point, unless I misunderstood completely.
Well, a boiling point of 88c is 190f, and I run my TC at around 450f which is about 232c. Wouldn't it be destroyed just the same?
Come on man, think about it.
You're in a forum dedicated to DIY juices. I would imagine you're well aware certain flavours can completely mask others. I'm sure the burning leaves and hundreds of other chemicals burning off in a cigarette do a damned good job at making the diacetyl less buttery.