I wasn't really listening to the commercial other than registering that it was for a local B&M. They were talking about mods, tanks, etc.
Then the lady goes: "And we make 100% safe e-juice - and you know that means NO PG!"
I'm like...did she just say what I think she said? No. No way. She couldn't have said that - a) no one can say juice is 100% safe, and b) WTF? No pg? So you're working with VG only flavors, which I know for a fact is difficult if not prohibitively expensive? And who says PG isn't safe? It's used in medical vaporizers! WTF? No way. I must have misheard.
End of commercial: "blah blah mods blah tanks blah.... and we're committed to making 100% SAFE custom e-juice!"
I don't even.
I have a bottle of 100% vg, it's a decent enough flavor but I payed $25/30ml
My friend has an extreme aversion/allergy to PG. Even Max VG (5-10% pg flavoring) still has him coughing hysterically. Everyone has different sensitives. Alcohol based flavorings are likely going to be the future, considering how powerful bases they can be compared to VG, if we do start trending towards pg-free.
VG/PG ratio has been going towards VG mainly because of the advent of high powered devices. It is uncomfortable to vape 50/50 on a 80W RDA, very irritating to the throat. That is why 70/30 right now is the standard, tolerable on high wattage rda but workable with these new sub ohm tanks. 80VG/20PG will probably be the standard in another 3-6 months, and so the cycle continues to the point where people want Max VG/no pg preferable. It really comes down to tanks... most vapers use tanks so that is why there hasn't been as much of a push towards pg free yet, wicking issues and flavor not as strong as say 60/40 or 70/30 so vendors are afraid of their product being inferior or lacking in flavor.
PG does have its place though. It is a strong flavor carrier, and it provides a "throat hit" that many new vapers right off the cigarette appreciate and desire and help them quit. So I can't see PG going away for this reason, it is an interesting balance.
PG is an alcohol though. I don't know which "alcohols" would be better suited for vaping as I wouldn't want to put ethanol in my lungs. Oil-based flavorings are also available but are strictly not for vaping. 70/30 has been the "standard" for several years now and MAX VG has been popular for at least 2. People want bigger clouds and VG provides that, while flavor hasn't been an issue for a long-time so PG hasn't been as necessary. I also don't see stronger bases gaining huge traction due to the hindrance of fine-tuning recipes(maybe in mass production though).
PG is actually a diol. Alcohol is a generic term in chemistry reflecting a hydroxyl group of many very different molecular compounds. Alcohol is commonly addressed to refer to ethyl alcohol but many alcohols are not that alcohol.
and they probably make that crap onsite in their dirty back room (I imagine) I have been to lots of shops like this and seen lots of juice vendors say they're 100 percent VG. When someone says that I dismiss them and walk away.
There is a shop in my town that claims "PG free" juice. I went there once. My problem with them is that they have a TON of flavors and their juice is the consistency of 50/50. They dilute with lots of alcohol (at best). Also, they eyeball mix in front of you with old ass syringes from mason jars. Ew.
That is scary shit.
I bought 2 little bottles because I had heard great things and also just to support the store. Then I saw how they mix and the viscosity of the juice... If the guy hadn't been really nice and ex-military I would have thrown both of them into the trash can right outside the front door on the way to the car.
Alcohol based flavours are easy to get.
They ain't safe because they give off ethanol when vaporized
Don't know why this is seen as "bad info" as ethanol is not something to put in your lungs regularly.
I call bogus. I was a PAD red smoker for at least 18 yrs, when i quit & started vaping i could not believe how much better i felt, like i had a whole new body/life, & all these yrs later i can not say i know of any side effects or negatives from vaping...none. my ADV has been MBV's grape @50/50 for like 2 yrs now & i swear it just keeps getting better. The direction this community is heading is starting to scare me, vaping is the best damn thing thats happened to me & i dont wanna lose it
More and more people will be giving up PG in 2016. I forecast this 6 months ago right here on Reddit.
I've been spending that time working with PG free recipes because I'm hearing more and more people reduce PG ratio and see some positive health correlations.
I'm PG free except for taste testing eliquids minimally. All my friends but a handful have switched to PG-free.
There's a LOT I don't know about the chemistry involved, I freely admit that. But isn't PG the primary flavor carrier? If you make a max VG juice, usually you have to use a higher concentration of flavors, as I understand it.
Isn't it difficult and expensive for you to get non-PG flavor concentrates? Do you think the big vendors are going to start offering PG-free concentrates?
There are 9 flavor vendors that offer some or all of their flavors free of PG.
It is a lot more difficult to make strong concentrates with VG as VG isn't as soluble for aroma volatiles. But it can be done.
Optional diluents like triethyl citrate and triacetin are workable for flavor carriers and to reduce viscosity.
Cost is higher but market research shows people are willing to pay more for PG-free or reduced PG.
So the commodity shitjuice vendors will race to the bottom and the premium juice lines will lower PG as far as possible.
What about people who are VG sensitive? I can't handle high VG - it has a waxiness that I find unpleasant, and I become nauseated if I vape it too long. If I push past that, vaping it makes me congested to the point that I get a liquid "rattle" in my chest. Best I can figure is that it is an allergy of some kind, but I hate how many juices are now high VG only. The sensitivities do go both ways.
There's evidence of glycerin reactions as well although far lower than PG ones. Very few in vaping but it's tough to pinpoint because so many people who say they're allergic to VG haven't tried PG-free juices when I've requested them to.
Glycerin is a polyol but from a chemistry standpoint it's also the "backbone" of all triglycerides (vegetable oils, animal fats, etc). So glycerin is pretty common in a lot of what we interact with and eat (but not inhale, generally). PG is a diol and generally is low risk as well, but it does appear to be more reactive with people than VG.
I'm not aware of any personal sensitivity to glycerin in other forms - I seem to be fine with it ingested or topically. It's just inhalation that gives me that "wet lung" effect, and then only over a certain percentage. I seem to be fine up to about 60%, although I find the taste starting to become very waxy at that point.
That said, I haven't tried PG-free juices, just high/max VG ones. Right now, though, I can avoid the symptoms by not maxing out the VG, so that's good enough for me.
This x1000. It seemed pretty inevitable to us at the beginning of this year that PG was fading out. The majority of orders seemed to switch to higher VG blends pretty quickly. I'll admit that I found non-pg based flavors a bit more difficult to work with initially but since then I have made some great recipes using alcohol based flavors.
Yep.
There 2 flavor concentrate vendors I've been consulting with on the backend who will be releasing a crap ton more PG-free flavorings. I can't give much info because (1) it's good income for me and (2) the vendors don't want to be associated with my public character because they're in it for the $$$.
Effin' A cotton someone's been downvoting you on damn near every comment you've got in this thread. You piss someone off recently?
I'm harsh with my opinions and the legbeards and neckbeards don't like my shit.
Male vapers carry boxes, which represent their control over the female vagina while you force women to use the tubes, which represents the patriarchy forcing women to suck on penises. This isn't Jezebel or The Mary Sue, these are just facts you misogynist. I bet you play oppression simulators too(video games shitlord). Don't forget to donate to my Patreon, $1 = one less harassment.