I was having a problem where every juice batch I made felt spicy and harsh like there was too much nicotine, even though I know it was +/- 3mg. The reason why I was getting such harsh hits was because the nicotine I was starting with was at 12mg. The amount of nicotine liquid used in my mix to get the nicotine level I preferred was too high which resulted in the harshness. The fix was as simple as starting with a higher level of nicotine liquid.
For example, mixing a 30 ml required me to use 7.5 ml of 12mg nicotine liquid. After switching to 100mg nicotine liquid, that same mix requires about 0.9 ml.
This isn't revolutionary or anything, but I couldn't figure out why I was getting harsh batches and I know others may have the same problem. Now my juices are nice and smooth. Hope this helps!
Though it is nice your trying to help others with this,
- what ratio was both of them 100% vg 50/50 100% pg?
- was both bases from the same vendor?
- Age of the nicotine used?
- was there discoloring to it? This partially related to 3, since older nic oxidizes and turns yellowish.
All of these things matter a lot, simply saying you switched bases doesn't mean much, if you were using 100%pg base, then yes reducing the amount of pg your adding to the whole will reduce throat hit. As well as if your using nic from a vendor that doesn't properly store it etc, it will get harsh, so if comparing A.shit vendor high pg, to B. Good vendor 50/50 or high vg, you can get where this is going.
Good point.
Both the 12mg and the 100 mg used are 100% VG. The nicotine I buy is from Wizard Labs, which from what I hear is a reputable source. The age of the nicotine shouldn't be that old if they do what the claim (not premixed/made to order). No discoloring to the nicotine, both are clear. Like most people here, I start making batches the day my order comes in the mail.
VG or PG? If it was VG, I'd be a little surprised if that was causing the harshness. PG would make more sense since the PG would have a higher ratio with the 12mg nicotine causing more throat hit and harshness.
I'm using VG nicotine. The reason why I wondered if the nicotine was the issue was because it felt like I was dripping 6mg instead of 3mg and not the feeling of dripping a juice with more PG. Most of the liquids I was buying before mixing my own were 50/50. When I used cartomizers a few years ago, I got the same spicy/harsh feeling when I tried a 24mg juice instead of the 12mg juice I was normally using.
Wait, what? You are still using the same amount of nicotine. It doesn't matter how diluted the nic was to begin with, 3mg is 3mg. The only way to explain this is that your first batch of nicotine was not labeled correctly. Maybe you were using 24mg the whole time you thought you were using 12mg.
"For example, mixing a 30 ml required me to use 7.5 ml of 12mg nicotine liquid. After switching to 100mg nicotine liquid, that same mix requires about 0.9 ml."
OP is saying the nicotine amount from the nicotine base. Initially, 7.5% of his juice was the nicotine base. After he switched to 100mg, 0.9 of his juice was the base. A difference saved of about 6.6 mL in 30 mL. If his nicotine was oxidized, and it sounds like it was, then that 6.6% would make a huge difference.
So no, it's not the amount of nicotine, it's the amount of nicotine base (12mL vs 100mL) that is changing it. His recipe still has the same nicotine amount, but it's more concentrated, and less peppery, although it's likely the new juice isn't as oxidized which is helping quite a bit towards his issue.
> A difference saved of about 6.6 mL in 30 mL
That 6.6ml is pure VG. Why would that make any difference?
>His recipe still has the same nicotine amount, but it's more concentrated, and less peppery
How can you have the same amount of nicotine AND be more concentrated? As long as OP's math is right (or he is using the calculator correctly) it makes zero difference how strong your nicotine base is. You can use 100mg nicotine and add your VG later, or you can use 12mg nicotine and have you VG included with your base. Either way you end up with the same 3mg final product, whether you added the VG yourself or let Wizard Labs add the VG to your base for you.
I highly doubt that peppery nicotine was the cause, especially at 3mg/ml. A mislabeled bottle is much more likely.
Nicotine from Wizard Labs has a tendency to get peppery and harsh the more it oxidizes. As you use the 100mg nic you will probably notice your juice coming out harsh again. I was having the same issue and was racking my brain as to what I was doing wrong. It shouldn't matter what your starting nic levels are, it should be the same once it is diluted down. Try nude nicotine. I believe they offer free samples. They are the best nic in my experience and won't get crazy peppery over time. It has to due with purity. If you find that over time your juice starts to get harsh again then this is your problem.
So you're saying you switched from 12mg nic base to 100mg nic base and didn't change your ratios?
That's scary, and a pretty minor basic math error with pretty big impact... upvote for being gutsy enough to share :)
I may not be explaining it in the best way, but I did change my ratio when I switched to 100mg. The harshness in my example was from using 7.5 ml of 12mg liquid to get to a 3mg level in my 30 ml's. The difference in the amount of nicotine liquid used to get to a 3mg level in my mix is what took away the harshness. So for a 30 ml at 15% flavor, it would be 0.9 ml of 100mg nicotine liquid to get to a 3mg level instead of 7.5 ml of 12 mg nicotine liquid to get to a 3mg level.
thats still the same amount of nicotine, though. What you changed was the ratio of base/carrier included w/ the nicotine mix to the vg/pg you added yourself.
That's correct. I'm not sure why it made such a difference, but it solved my problem of harsh juices. I tried the same recipe back to back, and the juice where I used 100mg > 3mg was not harsh, where as the 12mg > 3mg was harsh. That's probably not the correct way to do science, but it seemed like the best way to figure out my hypothesis haha.