On my way home today I came across a B&M with an interesting sign in the window: a big banner with a popular flavor brand name and another with the word E-cigs. I thought, "Sweet! DIY supplies! Maybe they carry other flavor brands too!". So, I walk in and really didn't like what I saw: a big island counter with their mixes, their flavorings etc just kind of everywhere. The person working said "Oh hey! Just mixing some over here", and well... I didn't see gloves, a clean suit, nor a sterile room.
I mix my own personal juices without a sterile room and the other stuff, but if I were to sell my juice I wouldn't feel comfortable unless I took steps to be as sterile as I could.
Can anyone else give their perspective on this business' method of mixing in the open and non-sterile?
If I wanted to tell the owner, "Hey, as a fellow DIY'er... I really think it doesn't help the community or the market to not do mixing in a sterile environment if you're going to have it as a store front", how would you do it?
Once I saw someone mixing and selling their juice out doors at a flea market. as if the 1buck per ml price tag wasn't bad enough.
Wow. Were people actually buying that?
If they're mixing made to order juice I don't necessarily think that a clean suit and a sterile room should be necessary. However I think that as far as making a good professional impression they might want to do things like a coffee shop. A clean organized mixing station, disposable gloves when mixing and food-service hand-washing procedures.
I personally think anything more than that would be overkill in that type of environment, requiring a lot of overhead in Tenant Improvements and personnel to maintain. Good kitchen type procedures, hand washing, gloves, and common sense should be sufficient to ensure safety.
If I was interested in helping them step up their game up I'd try to establish rapport and volunteer to help set things up like a nice coffee shop.
If they achieve modest success they might then be able to start thinking about mixing in a lab setting, but honestly I don't know that there's any product superiority with that vs. basic cleanliness and common sense. As far as I can tell laboratory style mixing is a combination of marketing and taking steps to ensure that impending regulation won't shut a vendor down.
When I mix juices for people I always use gloves and mix in the back room of my friend's computer shop. My desk is very clean and I use alcohol to sterilize everything. I use syringes to measure with, and use a new needle for juices. I don't wear a clean suit, I'm not sure if that's quite necessary.
That said, I totally use the same needle and syringe when I mix my own juice and just toss it in a cup of alcohol. I wouldn't do that for someone else's juice though.
I feel the same about mixing for others, which is part of the reason I rarely mix for other folks. If I had the time to fully prep and clean a space and utensils for mixing as you do, I'd mix for others. Without that at my disposal, I feel I'd be doing a disservice to anyone I mixed for because I couldn't stand behind the product I'm handing over.
that sounds pretty shitty. the local b&m that opened up recently has 3/4 of a glass paned wall between the mixing area and the shop/lounge. It looks very professional with all the instruments and mixing shit layed out neatly. He always wears a clean lab coat because hes constantly mixing to order. his flavors are pretty good but i often order online because he charges a lot.
Lol, I totally agree. It's the perception to me, that is the issue. I've seen some shops that mixed their own juice, that I felt were less than professional an kind of dirty like I would expect from a bad headshop. For all I know, they could have made the most amazing juice in the world, but because of the condition of the shop I would never buy thier juice. I expect a certain level of professionalism from people making something that I am going to inhale. I make juice, and just for my own safety I wear gloves. You are handling fairly high concentrations of liquid nicotine that is a poison, and you should treat it as such. If you don't care about your own safety, why would I think you'd care about mine?
Ok. First of all, if you are making juice I highly recommend looking into AEMSA certification, or at least following the guidelines.
Second, this is highly unacceptable. Think about going to a restaurant. Would you eat food that was prepared by a stranger who wasn't wearing gloves or a hairnet, or even an apron or something? Yeah, probably not, and if so, the worst thing that might happen is food poisoning or like E. Coli that might kill you, and that is going in your stomach. Think about what would happen if you were atomizer and inhaling something like that. I'm not a fan of regulation on anything, but it will stop unhygienic practices like this. To me this is careless and putting your customers in danger. What is she hadn't washed her hands after going to the bathroom and now you have poop in your juice. Would you like to vape that? Nah, I didn't think so.
While I appreciate your concern for the health and welfare of your fellow vaper I wonder if this kind of thinking might be detrimental to the community as a whole.
If they were mixing with clean tools and had washed their hands before they began there's not necessarily an actual hygiene problem taking place. Even if they just came from the restroom and didn't wash hands E. Coli is never going to survive the temperatures required to vaporize juice.
Are they presenting things unprofessionally and potentially dangerously (possible concentrated nic juice on a counter top in the middle of retail space)? Absolutely. Beyond that it doesn't seem like they were acting egregiously.
We should be doing our best to help our local B&M's get their act together by giving input, helping them change, and if that fails taking our business elsewhere and educating local vapers to do the same.
If we think that regulation is going to have any effect on people mixing juices in unsanitary conditions we're deluding ourselves. There are plenty of people I can get bathroom moonshine from in my area, and plenty of people drinking it with no more ill effect than anyone buying alcohol from state sanctioned alcohol dispensers.
My fear is that regulation is going to focus primarily on end users and mixing conditions rather than purity of ingredients from suppliers and research into the effects of flavor molecules. The former regulation will just drive current business out allowing Big Tobacco and Pharma to come in and clean up, while delivering lower quality product than we currently have. The latter regulation would actually help us make better informed decisions about what we put in our bodies.
Poop I have to live with, mesothelioma I'd prefer to avoid.
I'm with you on helping out the local shops do things professionally. The details about location etc are left out so that I'm not putting that specific shop out on blast. The person in the shop seemed genuinely nice, but perhaps misguided about the minimum safety and cleanliness vapers sort of expect.
I really want to do what I can as a potential customer to suggest things that would prevent their shop from losing business or getting shutdown due to careless actions. Plus I'd really like to have access to flavorings and nic locally.